Cost of decent SME IV or V for my Orbe SE

[Tarzan]

I buy most Hi-Fi from overseas, many sources such as MCRU and from 2juki in Hong Kong. No problems and quick delivery. Someone, Marco I think, pointed out that the issue with 2nd hand arms can be the bearing. Even then the risk can be ameliorated by, as Rexton says, getting it serviced.

B'Jesus- Brooky moved to Hong Kong? Tax purposes?

[AlfaGTV]

Thanks for all input here!
Unfortunately emporiumhifi wont accept offers below the £1550 requested.
Tried the wam but couldnt find any SME IV/V of interest for sale. (Other than a IV with suspicious damage)

I am beginning to lean towards a V, but there are some versions of these around too?
With removable headshell
Gold print
Gold plated

Other than the obvious practical advantage of a removable headshell, are there any audible diffences between editions?

Regards Mike

[SLS]

Thanks for all input here!
Unfortunately emporiumhifi wont accept offers below the £1550 requested.
Tried the wam but couldnt find any SME IV/V of interest for sale. (Other than a IV with suspicious damage)

I am beginning to lean towards a V, but there are some versions of these around too?
With removable headshell
Gold print
Gold plated

Other than the obvious practical advantage of a removable headshell, are there any audible diffences between editions?

Regards Mike

There's another one here

http://www.centralaudio.co.uk/index....roducts&id=464

I bought quite a few items from Tony and he's a very nice guy, open to offers. He's had this arm quite a while.
Not far from Audio Origami to check out/upgrade.

[hifi_dave]

In the UK the SME IV is £1894 and the V is £2750.

Occasionally, I have a dem one.

[Wakefield Turntables]

Stick with the fixed head shell, you dont have to piss about aligning overhang etc, with regards the gold version I would just ignore this, buy a normal V and upgrade any surfaces that conduct with silver.

[paskinn]

Over the years I've had a load of Series Fives, and also the 12inch version. A few basic points.
1) Because the Five was released 25 years ago, and is largely unmodified, with no 'mark 11s', it has become an unusually 'mature' market...there are few bargains. You get what you pay for.
2) Like everything else, they do 'age'...especially the bearings and slightly vulnerable bits like the hydraulic lift mechanism. Wiring can go short circuit too. Therefore either buy a late model, around £1800, or buy a nice old model and have it serviced by J7 or SME (if you have worn bits, such as bearings, SME sometimes replace them for free, so the more expensive SME service is sometimes a bit of a bargain.) otherwise, J7 is a sensible option.
3) The series Four and Five are essentially the same arm, the Five has the damper and easier vta adjustment, but identical performance. The 309 gets very close..and as been said, it's hard to hear the difference.
4) The 12inch versions are especially lovely, if your deck is big enough. To my ears they do sound a bit better (smoother, more at ease).
5) Don't forget the 'M' series. These arms can sound really fine and cost a lot less. there is a bit of 'snobbery' here. In many systems an M10 will work just as well..depending on cartridge. In the same way, the j shaped 12inch version with an SPU is pretty unbeatable.

Finally, if you are feeling flush, buy a new arm. That way you know it has been well cared for. Keep it for many years, getting J7 to give it a check up once in a while. Buy it in the country you live, support local dealers. You might need them at some point.
And don't forget to keep the box, leaflets and all tools....they are pricey to replace. If buying second hand, you want this stuff, or a lower price. The absence of tools and a box is the first warning sign that the arm may not have been treated with loving care. Too many of them have had a lot of owners, which, like cars, is not good. You want a one-owner sample with box and tools.

[AlfaGTV]

Thanks paskinn, thats all very good advice and knowledge!
I'll be looking around for a while, something will surely turn up, even if i have to pay a bit more than expected.
Besides, my Orbe is making beautiful noise with its Audio Origami RB-250 atm.

Regards Mike

[Marco]

Hi Peter,

2) Like everything else, they do 'age'...especially the bearings and slightly vulnerable bits like the hydraulic lift mechanism. Wiring can go short circuit too.

Indeed, but of course according to the 'cognoscenti' on pfm, SME arms are completely immune from any aspects of ageing and/or deterioration, due to extended use, or the effects of the environment...

Good job you're thick-skinned, so well done for keeping your cool against the unfortunate behaviour of some of the old miseries over there. The intolerance, sneering disdain and overall unpleasant tone, shown on certain contributions on that thread, was unacceptable. I've never understood why folk have to be so condescending and rude when disagreeing with someone else's opinion. It's pathetic and completely unnecessary.

Anyway, like you said: "It is clear to me that many people don't want their illusions disturbed." You've hit the nail on the head there!!

Also, as someone else said, how can you be sure that your tonearm definitely won't benefit from a service? Here I'm not thinking necessarily of bearing wear, but rather, as Mark (YNWaN) pointed out: "What is possible is that five years of being in a centrally heated room starts to dry out the bearing lubricant and stiction increases."

Barrymagrec also wrote something similar: "The only reason that I can see for servicing an arm would be to clean the build up of dirt and dried lubricant in the bearings, assuming no physical damage. How frequently this is required must depend on the circumstances of use."

Therefore, for a moment, leaving aside actual bearing wear, simply by flushing out and re-lubing the bearings, as well as checking the bearing torque, after five years of use, and making any appropriate adjustments (especially when, as you said, SME reported the bearings on your arm as having loosened slightly), who's to say that the cumulative effect of all of that wouldn't not only have improved performance, but have been, legitimately, entirely necessary after a tonearm had been used every day and exposed to temperature and environmental fluctuations for five years??

I'm pretty certain it would, especially as I consider the above as feasible areas for concern (particularly the highlighted bit in blue) after a tonearm has been extensively used over such a period of time, and so, IMO, perfectly explain what you've heard and reported with your Series V, much to the disdain of those whose thought processes are unfortunately rigidly governed by their engineering and/or scientific doctrine (or pedantic idiots who simply get off on being argumentative)!

Basically, it's the usual case of intolerant sceptics pooh-poohing that which doesn't fit with their academic belief system.

Anyway, I hope you're enjoying AoS. I think you'll find that people here are rather more open-minded, friendly, and tolerant of views that make you consider something as relevant, which you perhaps hadn't considered before!

Marco.

P.S For those interested in reading the thread on pfm, it is here: http://www.pinkfishmedia.net/forum/s...d.php?t=151083

[Joe]

Anyway, I hope you're enjoying AoS. I think you'll find that people here are rather more open-minded, friendly, and tolerant of views that make you consider something as relevant, which you perhaps hadn't considered before!

As long as you don't mention what book you're reading!

[Ali Tait]