All this talk of head amps got me looking......

[Arkless Electronics]

I built a MC preamp some time ago using matched pairs of Mullard E88CC valves with DC heater supply. Beautiful liquid midrange, but obviously noisier than SUTs and SS preamps. In the end I replaced it with various SS devices.

Perhaps I should dig it out and see if it could be improved?

Why not... I may even dig out mine and update it a bit! I may have problems with finding enough valves that are quiet enough now though

[belloire]

the phono stage in my AI S200 pre is all valve. uses 2 x ecc83 + 1 x ecc82 for the mm stage, and a further ecc83 for the mc. (is 88 the norm for this? or does 2 x 88 = 1 x 83?)

it is a bit noisy, but it's also seen of some very good competition.... i have a nice SUT to try with the mm stage now too, so i'll see how that goes

[Arkless Electronics]

the phono stage in my AI S200 pre is all valve. uses 2 x ecc83 + 1 x ecc82 for the mm stage, and a further ecc83 for the mc. (is 88 the norm for this? or does 2 x 88 = 1 x 83?)

it is a bit noisy, but it's also seen of some very good competition.... i have a nice SUT to try with the mm stage now too, so i'll see how that goes

An ECC83 is not a good idea for a head amp! It's far too noisy and has characteristics that just don't suit using it in such a way..... Are you sure there's no SUT? I'm certainly not saying it wouldn't work, just it would likely be very noisy even by valve head amp standards...

The ECC88 (6DJ8, 6922, E88CC) is by far the most popular valve for head amps. There are even better valves than the ECC88 but non that aren't very expensive and difficult to obtain.

[belloire]

we thought the same, but can't see any transformers. it's most odd, and though it's a bit noisy, it's really good. i'm going to look for a low microphony 83 to replace the one that's in there, see if it makes a difference.

[Marco]

An ECC83 is not a good idea for a head amp! It's far too noisy and has characteristics that just don't suit using it in such a way.....

Am I understanding this wrongly, Jez? Isn't Darren saying that he uses ECC83s (together with 82s) in his phono stage, not his head amp? Certainly, that's what he appears to be saying here:

the phono stage in my AI S200 pre is all valve. uses 2 x ecc83 + 1 x ecc82 for the mm stage, and a further ecc83 for the mc.

Marco.

[Arkless Electronics]

Am I understanding this wrongly, Jez? Isn't Darren saying that he uses ECC83s (together with 82s) in his phono stage, not his head amp? Certainly, that's what he appears to be saying here:





Marco.

It seems to me that what is being described is an all valve phono stage with an internal MC head amp using ECC83's rather than an internal SUT... unless it's me that's misunderstanding it!? Maybe if Darren can be bothered to post some close up pics of the circuitry we can get to the bottom of this.. A ECC83 is a VERY bad choice for a MC head amp To the point that I'd be surprised if there is not more to the story here

[Marco]

Yes, it's all rather confusing... ECC83s would indeed be a brutal choice of valve for a head amp, but not a phono stage. The two are separate entities - or not, in Darren's case!

Tune into next week's episode where all will be revealed....

Marco.

[belloire]

rather than not being bothered, i don't presently have a pic of the stage internals (if i can be bothered seems a little harsh, i only offered information!)

there are 2 versions of the S200, 1 with MM only, 1 with MC. the difference is the extra ecc83 and some bits, but the step up is all valve (i'm told).

i don't know anything about electronics in reality, but i do know the phono stage is very good, punching way beyond the £250 i paid for it as a passive preamp with a phono stage built in.

[Arkless Electronics]

rather than not being bothered, i don't presently have a pic of the stage internals (if i can be bothered seems a little harsh, i only offered information!)

there are 2 versions of the S200, 1 with MM only, 1 with MC. the difference is the extra ecc83 and some bits, but the step up is all valve (i'm told).

i don't know anything about electronics in reality, but i do know the phono stage is very good, punching way beyond the £250 i paid for it as a passive preamp with a phono stage built in.

No offence intended! All I meant by it was that I would perfectly understand someone not wanting to go to the trouble of removing it from their system, taking the lid off and then taking photos and posting them on here all just for the sake of our curiosity!

[PaulStewart]

Well It's arrived thanks to the wonders of Parcel Force who combined with PayPay crashing when I tried to select another delivery address, delivered it to my office (no one was there, we were out on assignments) It should have gone to our warehouse, where of course there were people to sign for it. However, it's at home the Mrs. has unpacked it, plugged it in and switched on the Stax energiser, so it will be ready for me to wire up and have a listen to, when I get this paper to bed and go home around 2:00am However I can't wait really intrigued with this one.

Cheers all