Deep breath- carts for around £300

[twelvebears]

This is all quite timely for me. I've recently returned to the joys of vinyl after years with digital only sources and it's great.

Currently have stock SL-1210 which I'm going to start tuning up.

One slight bonus I've just discovered is that my Musical Fidelity M3's phono stage is (according to Stereophile) a) pretty decent (without spending a sizable chunk of a separate stage) and b) already able to handle a MC input via a simple switch inside the case, though why they hid it here is anyone's guess.

So I'm in the market for a cart which will improve on my Goldring 1022GX (which is probably due a new stylus anyway) without going too mad.

The two options which immediately spring to mind are the DL-304 and AT-OC9ML/II

Any views on which would work best in a stock arm initially and then to stepped improvements like a AT headshell and re-wire?

[Alex Nikitin]

So I'm in the market for a cart which will improve on my Goldring 1022GX (which is probably due a new stylus anyway) without going too mad.

One easy option is to get a new 1042 stylus for your Goldring.

Alex

[Marco]

TB,

What's your first name, mate?

Both of those cartridges would work pretty well in the stock arm - but you must fit a decent headshell first, even before rewiring, (such as the AT or Sumiko), as the stock one is crap. It's the only way that you'll hear what the 304 or OC-9 are capable of doing.

Regarding which one to choose, they both sound quite similar, majoring on a sweet, detailed, but not too forward sound. I'd say that the OC-9 has a bit more 'balls', as well as bags of refinement, and tracks better than the 304, but the latter has a way with music in the midrange that's quite beguiling and almost 'valve-like'. I guess that much would depend on your taste in music. The OC-9 is probably the better all-rounder.

However both cartridges offer performance way in excess of their price tags, which is what you get when you buy an MC cartridge from a major Japanese manufacturer which has invested in all the tooling necessary to mass-produce high quality designs without the need to charge the manufacturing premium of smaller cartridge manufacturers. In short, both are veritable 'giant killers' and as such offer high sound-per-pound value.

Another option of course is the DL-103, but you'll have to spend much more to get that to work properly.

Marco.

[twelvebears]

Hi Marco.

The name's Steve btw, sorry, forgot I'd not signed my post!

Anyway, have already ordered a Sumiko headshell, I'd spotted that the original wasn't exactly precision made, which is a shame considering it's not that much less than the Sumiko.

I've got a opportunity to get a very lightly used DL304 from friend (who treats everything with great care) for just under £200.

Apart from the cart, and headshell, seems to me that replacing the standard arm leads, trailing leads and plugs.

Assuming the later is a worthwhile move, what's the best way to get it done?

Regards

Steve

[Marco]

Hi Steve,

Nice one on the 304 - I'm sure you'll enjoy it

If you'd asked me that question last year I'd have said KAB in the States; however that was before the new Jelco arms were released. My advice would be, if you can, to stick with the stock arm and Sumiko headshell and save up for either a Jelco SA-250ST or SA-750D, both available here from Dave at Sound Hi-fi. These tonearms sound tremendous on an SL-1200 or 1210.

The reason I say that is because I don't think that it's worth spending too much money on upgrading the stock arm when you'll probably end up changing it for something else later down the line, especially considering how keenly priced the Jelcos are.

If however in the meantime you would still like to tweak your existing arm then contact J7 at Audio Origami. Johnnie's arm rewiring charges represent great value and his work is immaculate.

Failing that, you could look at just upgrading the headshell leads to something like those from Clearaudio (available on-line form Analogue Seduction) - even the ones supplied with the Sumiko aren't that great, and also upgrading the stock counterweight balance to a custom-made solid brass one. I can supply details of the person to contact regarding this if you wish.

The decision though is yours

Marco.

P.S Do me a favour and add "Steve" to your signature - ta!

[muffinman]

Just letting you all know that i ended up with the AT-OC9ML/II.
It's a bit more ballsy than the denon and all in all i feel it's the right choice.
now that the deck is finished i'll give a full review of the terminator/AT-OC9ML/II/1200 in the coming week - it's very good

Oh Marco, i got Hard Candy and as good as it is i don't think it's Madges best production by a long way. Is it this or Confessions that you rate highly?
Either way, American life 2lp is still my 'demo disc' - absolutely stunning production

[Marco]

Nice one, Gareth. The OC-9 is a nice cartridge. I look forward to the review

Yes I like 'Hard Candy', but only because of some of the music on it, not particularly because of its production values, although the album sounds pretty good on vinyl. I agree in this respect that 'American Life' is better. 'Ray of Light' is another good one in terms of production quality and music, too!

Sad as it is, I was listening to her first album last night on vinyl from 1983 with stuff like 'Lucky Star' and 'Holiday' on it (yes I know!) and couldn't believe how much her style has changed since then - she's wearing not too badly either

Marco.

[griffo104]

The DL-301 II is probably cheaper than any of the above and provides 0.4mv output - which addresses your output concerns.
Check the review on the wam and make sure to follow to post # 22 for final conclusion after adjusting VTA, his initially lukewarm response changes to very positive.

My own observations on his review, he is using the same arm as I do, he is also (at the time of review anyway) using the relatively cheap Denon AU300LC SUT - which I also used initially.
Using those components he is preferring it over his previous Lyra.
I changed from the SUT to a GSP audio Exp and the improvement was not subtle.

From a purely selfish POV, I would be more interested if you try one of the lower compliance cartridges, just so I can read about how the Terminator handles it, but I can give very serious recommendation to the DL-301 II as a ridiculously good cartridge at a very competitive price.
Also worth noting is that the poster (think he has posted here also) is not apparently a fan of the DL-103 from some of his other remarks.
Given the improvement I heard in the plain vanilla DL-103 with the Exp v the AU300LC - I have to wonder how many have heard what that cart can really do given the opportunity.

Hi Tony,
that was the review wot I wrote

Things have actually moved on a lot since then. At the time of writing that #22 comment I was really getting in to the DL301ii but still overall prefered the Dorian BUT taking the price difference in to account I preferred the DL301ii.

It's about a year since I wrote that initial review and in that time I switched back to an older Goldring Elite for awhile and then switched back to the DL301ii. In switching these carts I came to the conclusion I didn't like the step up. the Elite was much better in the bass and was tighter with rhythms. So I ditched the step up, loaded the Aria right down, reinstalled the DL301ii and played with the antiskate, dropping it almost down to 0 in the Tecnoarm.

It should also be noted that I have the Michell decoupling mod in place in my set up.

Let's just say that a year on the DL301ii is still there, the Dorian is still in it's box. Doing the installation again, something I think you should do after 50 and then 200 hours, loading the Aria down and playing with other adjustments and I find this cartridge an absolute steal.

The bass has improved so much since doing this and going back the active phono direct, the vocals are still superb but the treble seems to reach higher and with no hint of harshness at all and at last the problems I had with the rhythm and timing are sorted - it sings with all types of music and classical, the main bugbear in my original review, is now sublime.

I've owned a few MC carts in my time, Lyra, Ortofons, other Denons and the Goldring Elite, and for the money this is the best. It has much better bass and a more impactful presntation than the DL304 but still has that subtlety and detail that carts has, maybe not quite as airy but I can live without that.

I've never gotten on with the DL103 but have plans to give it a try again at some point.

I thik the DL301ii is probably the best component I've bought, it was an amazing bargain for the price I paid for it.

In mp opinion, of course, I don't think there's anything under £500 that comes close to it's balance for the way I enjoy listening to music. It does so much so well.

[Tony G]

Hi,
good to hear your update, I did not buy mine on the strength of your review which I did not come upon until I had already bought it.
I had previously purchased the SUT and the DL-103 and while I liked that a lot I felt it limited in treble resolution, particularly on busy orchestral pieces.
I saw the 301 at a really good price (around $US230 when the $AU was much stronger than currently) and decided it might be a "good thing" - certainly is.

Hope you did not mind me quoting your review, felt it would add some "local authority" to the opinion of a "blow in" (petit moi ).
I was very interested that you were using the same SUT as I had initially and the same arm (I also have used a similar "constrained layer" type of mount as your Michell de-coupling)

I was quite amazed by the DL-103 when I upgraded to the Exp from the SUT in that things I had heard as limitations of the cartridge were shown to be limitations of the traffo. I do use a 4 gm lead spacer with the DL-103 - that is about as much as I can balance with the larger counterweight - I think the lead also provides an amount of resonance damping and de-coupling.
That's my half-ass theory anyway.

Good to read your thoughts on the 304 also, I had suspected it might lose some in the bass and kick dept where the 301 retains much of the abilities in that area of the DL-110 - IMO.

The 301 is not an easy act to follow, I am still thinking long and hard (and expensive) for another to try that will not be a retrograde move or a shift of emphasis.

[griffo104]

Hi Tony,

I have no problems with you quoting the review - it's good to see people reading it. I went looking for play with some SUTs and cheaper cart and found the Denon DL301ii on the audiocubes website - when I bought it the $ was 2 to 1 to the £ so it didn't cost me much at all (about £170 I think after customs).

I lived with the DL304 for about 4 years but found it lacking in the areas noted. I did a lot of research in tot he DL301ii as it's only really available in Japan but a few comments seemed to imply it was a good match with Rega based arms.

It's took a long time to get the setup right.

It's an interesting comparison with the Dorian. I still think the dorian is possibly my favourite cartridge. I know some don't like it but I love what it digs up out of the vinyl. The problem is, it's very hard to find fault with the Denon. It's just very enjoyable to listen to and if I'd never heard the Dorian then I would be more than happy to never need to spend more money.

Ironically while doing research for the cart, I found a few websites very much dedicated to vinyl, these guys don't even know cd was invented let alone have an argument over digital v analogue. The thing that surprised me was how many of these guys use cheap carts and are more than happy with them. The thinking was that they play records all day and it only costs £100 to £150 to get a new cart when the other wears out.

Made me wonder exactly what I was doing, tbh.

If you really like the Denon DL301ii, it may be worth trying to get a listen to a Shelter 901, it's much more expensive but you can see the DL301ii as a cheaper version of the 901, which is a very good carts but lacks what I enjoy in the Lyra carts.

I will revisit the DL103 though - I'm a bit more educated in vinyl since I last tried that cart.