Traders - Your thoughts on forums

[KCI-JohnP]

It's really refreshing to see this different approach that you guys across the pond are taking with this forum! Us MFG guys are just as much into audio as the next guy and it sucks when most forums look upon us with hostility just because we are "in the industry". Happy to be here, thank you!!

Best regards,
John

[Filterlab]

Or for a sweeter sounding hi-fi:

[WikiBoy]

Some very fair observations here guys, and yes Forum owners and moderators have a job to do, not an easy one I can vouch for that!
However, there are seriously bigoted, bias and plain paranoid people on these places, as there are fair minded and reasoned folks too.
Agenda's yes, that seems to crops up from time to time too, were people are accused of having one, or even being subversive in orchestrating one.
The internet is both a wondrous and dangerous place to be, common sense should prevail, however this is not always the case!
Richard, the properties of marmalade are well documented and give rise to a nth degree of proportionate rise in system musicality, therefore I second your proposal sir!

OK human nature is a distinctly peculiar beast, nowt so strange as folk etc etc. BUT there is acceptable behaviour and unacceptable behaviour and when that behaviour originates with the owners and moderators what chance do the simple members have to communicate and learn. A perfect case to point is Zerogain, it has a secret forum on it known as Guards Chat... How do I know this, well when the problem emerged at PF and I publically complained and left I was put under attack at ZG. I fought back which is my nature. They initially didn't ban me but put me on a moderated list which meant none of my posts were put up. At the same time they made the stupid mistake of giving me partial moderator status and access to Guards Chat. Well I then saw the conversations planning the attacks and discussing what to do with me, and who was mostly behind it, For the next 6 months I followed the soap opera of Guards Chat...

Anyway to cut a long story short after 6 months of me reading Guards Chat one of my customers joined ZG and started praising nva - on guards chat they decided he was me in disguise. I contacted the guy (who is a moderator on hi-fi forum, a small UK based audio forum) and he didn't believe me, so I gave him my login... Now it gets *really* bizarre, because he logged in from his IP and ZG has a program for showing up duplicate posters, that completely convinced them he was me. So to protect him I posted to them and explained and owned up to being on Guards Chat by accident. No reply but I was completely booted and Doc Foster (his HFF name) left in disgust with them, and my fun was terminated.

So perhaps now you see why I am so wary of forum owners and moderators - rant over!

[Filterlab]

So perhaps now you see why I am so wary of forum owners and moderators, who in my experience so far have been largely a bunch of manipulative dishonest individuals - rant over!

Uh oh boys, he's on to us!

Mmm, that's a sorry tale of deceit and skullduggery amongst folk who are supposed to share the same interests.

Richard, I can guarantee that nothing like that will happen here. Marco, Steve and myself all sing from the same song sheet in terms of having the ability to recognise that different people find strengths in different methods of music reproduction. We have the ability to understand different opinions and directions of people's search for quality audio (however crazy they may be) and wish to create an environment where folk can come together from anywhere in hi-fi land (whether a dealer, manufacturer, DIYer, enthusiast or journalist) and give their point of view and advice.

We (as admin) don't have a separate area for chatting behind people's backs and we treat everyone's opinion with equal validity - even if we don't personally agree with that opinion. As you said, human nature is a distinctly perculiar beast, but if handled in the correct way there's no reason why two very conflicting points of view can't rub along fine together.

As we all understand there is an 'art' element of constructing a hi-fi, we should all understand that people paint in different directions. Of course without trade folk there'd be no hi-fi, which is why we embrace traders from every walk of hi-fi life (although not in the biblical sense you understand).

[Mr. C]

Richard, I used to be one of the founding members of ZG along with Stereo Mic (Lovely chap off forum lol!).
I had not realised it had descended into a 'Poor mans masonic lodge' perhaps an outing is in order?
How the might have fallen, to be fair I don't think that practice is solely happening at ZG.
I suspect that when some of the mods/admin end up obtaining equipment from a certain manufacturer/s they then close ranks and protect that interest and see anything than even remotely encroaches on it as sacrosanct and must be dealt with with?
It just goes to show what lies behind the facade.
Who mods the mods?

[Steve Toy]

All I can say is be careful chaps. I can understand why Richard is sounding off here and I agree that he's had a bit of a rough deal, and one he won't be getting here.

However, we have to remember that the admin/mod guys from the above mentioned forums are looking in. I know this for a fact.

Richard,

Leave your baggage where it belongs and we'll do our best to ensure that you are treated kindly and fairly here.

I'd like to avoid any inter-forum slagfests where possible.

[Filterlab]

...I'd like to avoid any inter-forum slagfests where possible...

Agreed and it's part of our Ethos.

Steve; great word: 'Slagfest'. Sounds like a really badly organised open air concert.

[WikiBoy]

Richard, I used to be one of the founding members of ZG along with Stereo Mic (Lovely chap off forum lol!).
I had not realised it had descended into a 'Poor mans masonic lodge' perhaps an outing is in order?
How the might have fallen, to be fair I don't think that practice is solely happening at ZG.
I suspect that when some of the mods/admin end up obtaining equipment from a certain manufacturer/s they then close ranks and protect that interest and see anything than even remotely encroaches on it as sacrosanct and must be dealt with with?
It just goes to show what lies behind the facade.
Who mods the mods?

Well between the three of them WW - PF - ZG they have their protection sown up in their rules. You cannot discuss another forum or any problems occuring there. Threads will be removed and you face the possibility of being banned. Cartel mentality as talked about in another thread.

A case of birds of a feather stick together?

Anyway this is the first oportunity and only place where this is allowed to be discussed. Just that makes a large statement as to the status quo in UK hi-fi forum land. Though I will sing the praises of the WW members, who IMO have created a real community even though now it is sensored (not just me, look as Beresford and others). Their "bake-off" system I think is a finger pointing in the future direction of the Hi-Fi industry. I really do think you should implement it here as well.

[WikiBoy]

All I can say is be careful chaps. I can understand why Richard is sounding off here and I agree that he's had a bit of a rough deal, and one he won't be getting here.

However, we have to remember that the admin/mod guys from the above mentioned forums are looking in. I know this for a fact.

Richard,

Leave your baggage where it belongs and we'll do our best to ensure that you are treated kindly and fairly here.

I'd like to avoid any inter-forum slagfests where possible.

A milder form of sensorship is still sensorship. Baggage is opinion and experience, and on the subject of Hi-Fi is why (supposedly) this forum exists, in order to express it and discuss it. It is a slippery road you take with this post.

[Steve Toy]

Richard,

I'm in a very difficult position here. I intend to save us and you from charges of libel. Where the L word is mentioned censorship is unfortunately inevitable.

Whether you like it or not, this is the public domain and we are responsible for the outcome of what is written.