Speaker cable recommendations - Type of cable and where to buy.

[twelvebears]

OK folks, I need your collective wisdom/opinion.

My new listening room means I need new speaker cable to fit the new asymmetric layout. I've got some decent stop-gap ones from Mark Grant, so I have sound, but am looking for my permanent replacements.

Whatever I end up with, I need an 'odd' pair to account for the system being on one side - 5.5m and 3.5m as I'm long past buying the 'must be equal lengths' nonsense. Also, I would prefer them to come professionally terminated to remove my ham-fisted cable finishing from the equation.

Previously I used and been happy with the 'Black Mamba' cables supplied by Dave and Green Home Electronics but unfortunately Dave can't do custom lengths of these any more, so I'm resigned to the fact that whatever I end up with is likely to cost me substantially more this time round.

Thoughts and suggestions?

[Marco]

Hi Steve,

What's the budget, mate? Once I know that, I'll offer some reccos :)

Marco.

[John]

Perhaps one of the DIY guys could help

[twelvebears]

Hi Steve,

What's the budget, mate? Once I know that, I'll offer some reccos :)

Marco.

Cheers Marco.

Potentially it's quite flexible, but would prefer not to go nuts.

Max sound per pound is the name of the game as always.

[Reid Malenfant]

Can i ask if the speakers you are going to use are bi or tri wireable & if you intend on going this route? Or lets say you might or indeed would if the cables were good value?

Just so i get an idea ;)

[The Grand Wazoo]

Can i ask if the speakers you are going to use are bi or tri wireable & if you intend on going this route? Or lets say you might or indeed would if the cables were good value?

Just so i get an idea ;)

Mark,
There's a bit of a clue there in Steve's signature!

[Reid Malenfant]

Mark,
There's a bit of a clue there in Steve's signature!
:lol: Yeah i realise that now, however i'll still be interested in seeing how many cables are capable of being run to each speaker as i'm not familiar with the speakers ;)

We can all be a bit slow at times :doh: :eyebrows:

[Techno Commander]

VDC (http://www.vdctrading.com/default.asp)will make you cables using any of the Van Damme cables (http://www.vdctrading.com/products_gridview.asp?SubSectionID=1&secName=Van+Damme&ProductID=17#p17) to any length you require. They also have a good selection of spades and bananas. (http://www.vdctrading.com/products_gridview.asp?SubSectionID=170&secName=Audio+connectors&ProductID=957#p957)

[DSJR]

Ask Wilson Benesch.

The VDH Wind as used by Marco was always a good cable for speakers like yours and has a sort-of non-sound on speakers as Mark Grant's wires do to sources and amps..

Unless Marco has heard the ACT's, it's going to be difficult to suggest anything else as most expensive foo wires are tone-controls in disguise.

It'd be interesting to hear what KJ regard as a good speaker cable these days as they supplied your speakers as I recall.. When I left their sister shop for the last time, it was "The Wind" that received almost universal recommendation and this latter annihilated Chord Odyssey I remember, making the Chord wire sound splattery and "crude" with speakers like yours. It certainly didn't like the Tactic Act 1's I had for a while.

[Marco]

That's really weird, Dave, as I was about to suggest the very same thing!

Only trouble is it costs £25 a metre, and being a single conductor cable, you need two lengths per speaker (for both left and right channels), so in effect you need to look at it as £50 a metre, which would cost Steve £450 for the 9 metres he needs.....

I got mine from Futureshop, who were extremely friendly and efficient to deal with:

http://www.futureshop.co.uk/van-den-hul-the-wind-mkii-hybrid-speaker-cable-single-strand-p-1811.html

If Steve can go to that amount, then I can confidently say that VDH 'The Wind' is one of the best speaker cables I've heard at any price, outperforming truly esoteric stuff costing substantially more. There's some clever thinking responsible for its design.

Like you say, the VDH has a 'non-sound' in the way of the Mark Grant interconnects, and so doesn't exaggerate any one part of the frequency range. However it is undoubtedly a very open sounding and revealing cable, majoring on fine detail retrieval, so in conjunction with G1000 or 2000HD interconnects, you get a very wide open window onto the music.

The dedicated conductor per channel design I suspect is largely responsible for the transparency and openness of the VDH, as keeping the two conductors apart like this significantly reduces capacitance. High capacitance is one of the key factors responsible for muddying the sound of speaker cables.

I think in Steve's system the VDH would work very well, so if he's willing to fork out the cash, I can guarantee him some jaw-dropping moments as he sits back and rediscovers his music collection! :cool:

Marco.

[twelvebears]

I had sort of set myself a max budget of £500 for the 'right' cable, so The Wind would be do-able. The only big issue with cables (particularly speaker ones), is that they still aren't cheap and are something which is almost to get a home trial on.

Glad for the heads-up on the Chord stuff because that had been on my list of possibles.

[twelvebears]

While I'm at it, I may as well ask if people think that bi-wiring is a waste of time/effort/money, better invested in a better single cable and decent bi-wire jumpers?

[The Grand Wazoo]

If you decide to single wire Steve, then don't go wasting money on jumpers all you need is an extra 4 inches of the cable you're using.
I thought you'd be bi-amping though?

[Marco]

I'm with Chris on all counts. Biwring's a waste of time and money, IME. Otherwise, wot he said :)

Good news on the cable budget - I wasn't sure how much you had to spend. If you do go for the VDH, trust me, you'll be a very happy bunny!

Marco.

[MartinT]

Agreed on using a better single run of cable than bi-wiring, and use short lengths of the same cable to create the jumpers. However, if Steve is going to bi-amp then the decision's made.

Just to propose an alternative, I always found Kimber 8TC to be very good cable and at the lower end of their price range, good value.

[Barry]

If you decide to single wire Steve, then don't go wasting money on jumpers all you need is an extra 4 inches of the cable you're using.
I thought you'd be bi-amping though?

+ 1

[twelvebears]

If you decide to single wire Steve, then don't go wasting money on jumpers all you need is an extra 4 inches of the cable you're using.
I thought you'd be bi-amping though?

Not any more. The Chapters are on their way out after Chapter demonstrated a complete inability to do a minor service arranged by Audio Emotion in anything like a reasonable time OR actually respond to AE's attempts to keep in contact. If I'm investing in a new amp, I want to know the company behind it aren't a bunch of monkeys, and while that may be a bit harsh (the amps are actually great IMO), they certainly don't operate in a professional fashion.

I'm just awaiting my new MBL 7008 in exchange from Audio Emotion.

[The Grand Wazoo]

Oh yes, I remember. Sorry, that means I mislead folks a bit.

[MartinT]

The Chapters are on their way out after Chapter demonstrated a complete inability to do a minor service...

Steve - are Chapter the company formed by breakaway personnel from Chord Electronics, or am I thinking of another company?

[twelvebears]

Steve - are Chapter the company formed by breakaway personnel from Chord Electronics, or am I thinking of another company?

Nope, you're spot-on.

Unfortunately when they broke away, they didn't take any of the Chord professionalism with them....

[webby]

I'm with Chris on all counts. Biwring's a waste of time and money, IME. Otherwise, wot he said :)


Marco.

That's interesting, cos I've had it recommended to me many times. I've had to point out that my Dynaudio's do not allow biwiring. They are designed for single wiring.

[DSJR]

Just to tell you guys who don't know Wilson Benesch, their bi-tri terminal links underneath are solid custom BUS-BARS around 3mm thick at least, not some puny brass or gold plated tin things.. I really don't think that wire extensions would improve on what's there, but I could be wrong of course.

Far better to get the right speaker cable and enjoy single wiring.

I remember on a visit to the Sheffield factory that WB seem to like HUGE mono Class A amps and it certainly seemed their speakers were balanced for this, sounding one note honky bass, lean in the mid and tinny on more conventional ss amps.. get the power amp right and the sound fleshes out while retaining the lightning relfexes these speakers were renowned for.

[Spectral Morn]

If you decide to single wire Steve, then don't go wasting money on jumpers all you need is an extra 4 inches of the cable you're using.
I thought you'd be bi-amping though?

+ 1

Make jumpers from the cable you end up going for.

Regards D S D L

[Spectral Morn]

Nope, you're spot-on.

Unfortunately when they broke away, they didn't take any of the Chord professionalism with them....

IMHO I think that is a little unfair....

My experience was very different they sorted out a problem one of my customers had fairly quickly. This was however a few years ago.

However in saying the above they did let you and AE (could be a one off)down and for whatever reason that is not very good......


Regards D S D L

[twelvebears]

IMHO I think that is a little unfair....

My experience was very different they sorted out a problem one of my customers had fairly quickly. This was however a few years ago.

However in saying the above they did let you and AE (could be a one off)down and for whatever reason that is not very good......


Regards D S D L

Neil.

One thing I'm not is unfair OR impatient.

They have had (believe AE still don't have them back) the amps SINCE THE END OF MAY and all they had to do was replace a noisy fan and cracked perspex surround to one of the pre-amp control knobs.

In that time they have failed to answer phone calls and e-mails for days at a time, given reasons for the length of delay with strain credibility, made promises about a definite date by which the work would be completed and the amps returned which came and went without a word of explanation.

I would like to think that if you bought on of their current range of products, their level of support would be different but I'd not want to bet on it.

It's been sufficient to dissuade AE from taking them one, which they had been considering until this experience.

Anyway, not my problem now so I shall say no more.

Shame though, still like the product.

[ClasseAudio]

Hi. I am from the States and the cables that I have liked the most are from a local company here in Richmond Virginia. The company is Luminous Audio. The guy that makes the cables has been making them for years. Excellent quality and Tim is a great guy to deal with. Even if you don't ever purchase anything from them it's another site for you to take a look at. Happy listening.
http://www.luminousaudio.com/speakers.html

[pwood]

Up until very recently I bi-wired my speakers with all amps I had and then Bi-amped using my Onkyo 875 av amp. Something just wasn't right regards the image or soundstage so i had a play around. Bi-wiring was found to have an effect on the sound which initially sounded wider but after paying more attention it was actually pulling the image all over the place hard to describe but sort of a phase issue.

After being happy to admit I had wasted money I decided to try using my amp in normal stereo mode and whilst this cost nothing I was very surprised to find that to was f'in up the image as well. Cable wise I use Sterling Black Mamba now which is not an option now due to the lengths required. You may want to try Van Damme 6mm cable (http://www.audiovisualonline.co.uk/dynamic/eshop_products.set/ref/1603/van-damme-studio-grade-blue-series-speaker-cable-6mm/display.html) which would cost very little but is very well liked.

[The Black Adder]

I'm finding that single wire is much better in my last system and my current one too.

I don't know if this means anything to anyone but I once had a Densen DM-10, a dual mono affair. Nice integrated. It had a set of 4 binding posts on the back and so I thought I'd go bi-wire, I was trying to convince myself that it sounded better but you know what... it didn't, It sounded bright, brittle and unconvincing.

Now using Black Mamba's but I think I'll give the VDH The Wind a go later.

Does anyone know of the recommendations for a valve amplifier in regards to speaker cable? The Black Mamba has Low resistence, impedence and capacitance... not sure if you can have all of those as low to be honest, doesnt resistance and impedence go hand in hand? Slap me and tell me I know Naffin if I'm wrong there... :o

[Reid Malenfant]

Resistance is a DC thing, impedance is an AC thing & they can certainly differ by a huge margin depending on cable inductance & capacitance :eyebrows: