Best position for you and the speakers.......

[MikeMusic]

I need to do some testing myself and hopefully tomorrow

Assuming there is a golden triangle - what other things are important ?

For me Isobariks need to be flat against the wall so no added variables of against the wall v's whereabouts in the room, no toeing in either, I assume.

6' minimum apart, can more be better, if so how far ?

Seat in the centre of the speakers but how close if we have, say 6' apart, 6' back from the speakers ?

As the Isos are heavy and on spiked stands on spiked Mana bases moving them is a real job so I want to be sure there is merit in doing that.

[Reffc]

Move them far enough apart to get a decent stereo image for your seated position or move your seating position back or forth until you get the best stereo image. Too close for multi-driver speakers is never a great idea as you start to lose the coherence caused by the lobing patterns from the drivers integrating into a sweet spot area. Too far apart and a hole is created in the stereo image. Easiest way I find is to move in or out from the speakers (however far apart they are) until you find the best image, then work out your distance from the speaker plane and compare that with how far apart they are. You can then scale up or down the speaker separation to suit your desired seating position (room allowing). As close as you can get before you start to notice individual drivers is a good rule of thumb because can sometimes minimise the effects of reflections with respect to direct radiated sound. I find that for my listening room, the optimum distance back from the speakers is around 2.5 to 3m away with the speakers a similar distance apart. Every room/speaker set up is different though. Moving closer to the speakers and positioning them closer together (to compensate) often reduces the sidewall reflections and results in a far better image than placing them closer to walls and moving further back. That's why some people prefer listening with the speakers positioned on the long wall rather than the more usual short wall. At ceratain bass frequencies, by moving back a little at a time you can gain several dB bass volume because your ear coincides with the peak in the bass sine wave of the direct radiated signal or reinforced by certain room nodes.

[Sovereign]

I know what you mean about noticing individual drivers, I thought for a while that there was a slight mismatch between my 15" woofers and the mid and treble, I moved back a Foot and it all came together and the bass had more tone and texture.

[MikeMusic]

Thanks so much Paul, very helpful.

I took Russ Andrew's advice on my last shuffle and put the Isobariks as far apart as I could, around 10' or 3.5 metres and on the long wall of the room.
How does that sound ?
Historical advice was always to put Isos on the short wall, but when they are right in a corner they sound horrid so perhaps the long wall is best.......

[Reffc]

Thanks so much Paul, very helpful.

I took Russ Andrew's advice on my last shuffle and put the Isobariks as far apart as I could, around 10' or 3.5 metres and on the long wall of the room.
How does that sound ?
Historical advice was always to put Isos on the short wall, but when they are right in a corner they sound horrid so perhaps the long wall is best.......

It pays to experiment with room positioning Mike. The rule of thumb is not to go so wide as to create a hole in the stereo or too close as to muddle the imaging. What is important for all but corner placement speakers (which are very few these days) is to avoid placing speakers too close to side walls and the same distance to the side as out from the walls. The reason for avoiding equi-distant spacing is that it reinforces standing waves and causes bass-boom unless the side or rear wall is acoustically treated. To avoid this, don't have spacing the is equal from the side or rear PLUS avoid spacing which is an equal multiple (ie out 2 feet and away 4 feet etc) as this has the same effect. Be interested to learn how you get on.

[MikeMusic]

It pays to experiment with room positioning Mike. The rule of thumb is not to go so wide as to create a hole in the stereo or too close as to muddle the imaging. What is important for all but corner placement speakers (which are very few these days) is to avoid placing speakers too close to side walls and the same distance to the side as out from the walls. The reason for avoiding equi-distant spacing is that it reinforces standing waves and causes bass-boom unless the side or rear wall is acoustically treated. To avoid this, don't have spacing the is equal from the side or rear PLUS avoid spacing which is an equal multiple (ie out 2 feet and away 4 feet etc) as this has the same effect. Be interested to learn how you get on.

Thanks again Paul
Busy day yesterday so I only managed to measure the distance between the Isos, 2.8m from the inside edges, a tiny amount of positioning. With some listening just for enjoyment - ah Sundays
Too much else going on, boxes out of the loft ready to sell the old kit at last though !

Another question on the detail :
I have a solid pillar about 1m to the left of the left speaker, comes out around 250mm from the wall.
The right speaker has a flush to the wall, very solid, heavy fire door almost next to it, RHS, with the room corner just over a metre away.
Are they big influencers on sound ?
The whole set up is to the right of the room centre with 4 windows and French windows so loads of unfriendly hifi glass

My current seat is roughly 1m from the back wall with a window in it - so should be another reason to move from there !

[Reffc]

The simple answer Mike is that all such things will influence the sound. By how much depends on where the speakers are and what frequencies are affected. A relatively narrow pillar is unlikely to have much effect on bass but depending on its position relative to the front baffle of the speaker can have an influence on stereo image and HF reflections. Best with nothing in between speaker baffles, preferably no hard reflective surface just behind the listening position or in between the speakers but in real life domestic situations it's often hard to achieve. Suck it and see. You'll soon find the best positioning for your room/speakers, but bear in mind the rules of thumb mentioned above.

[MikeMusic]

Thanks again Paul

I'll move the seat around and find the ideal there.
Moving the speakers is a kot of work so that can come after I have the seat position sorted.
Do you think/guess the speakers will be ok moved closer together ? 2.8m seems about right form what you say earlier

[Reffc]

Thanks again Paul

I'll move the seat around and find the ideal there.
Moving the speakers is a kot of work so that can come after I have the seat position sorted.
Do you think/guess the speakers will be ok moved closer together ? 2.8m seems about right form what you say earlier

I often find that being either equi-distant from or slightly further away to speakers compared with their spacing apart works best for me, so if you sit 2.8m or more away or more, that should be fine. It really depends upon the speaker design and room acoustics though as what works for one may not work as well for another.

[sumday]

my wife says the best place for both is the shed....f**k her!!!

mind you, if she reads this I guess it'll be the spare room!!!

[Pieoftheday]

hi mike, ive been playing about with speaker position for a while just of late and finally settled on toeing my usher s520's out a little:scratch: this has widened the sound a fair bit and increased clarity, vocals/dialogue are central and projected more into the room than before. it goes against everything i was told but works for me in my room :), jim

[MikeMusic]

I often find that being either equi-distant from or slightly further away to speakers compared with their spacing apart works best for me, so if you sit 2.8m or more away or more, that should be fine. It really depends upon the speaker design and room acoustics though as what works for one may not work as well for another.

Thanks Paul. Once I'm testing I'll try that as well as forwards and backwards from there

[MikeMusic]

my wife says the best place for both is the shed....f**k her!!!

mind you, if she reads this I guess it'll be the spare room!!!

Or the garden !

[MikeMusic]

hi mike, ive been playing about with speaker position for a while just of late and finally settled on toeing my usher s520's out a little:scratch: this has widened the sound a fair bit and increased clarity, vocals/dialogue are central and projected more into the room than before. it goes against everything i was told but works for me in my room :), jim
Out !
Wow, that is a surprise, I assumed in woule be the way. I'll twiddle with the chair first then maybe get onto the speakers which need a lot of work moving being very heavy and spiked into 2 spiked stands

[Pieoftheday]

[QUOTE=MikeMusic;521960]Out !
Wow, that is a surprise, I assumed in woule be the way. I'll twiddle with the chair first then maybe get onto the speakers which need a lot of work moving being very heavy and spiked into 2 spiked stands[/QUOT yeah it is odd, straight on and things are flat and my ears start to hurt after a bit, my room isnt helping,toed in so they cross in front of me works well but somehow outwards,only a bit mind, seems best, thinking of some new floor standers so i may have to start all over again:doh:

[MikeMusic]

[QUOTE=MikeMusic;521960]Out !
Wow, that is a surprise, I assumed in woule be the way. I'll twiddle with the chair first then maybe get onto the speakers which need a lot of work moving being very heavy and spiked into 2 spiked stands[/QUOT yeah it is odd, straight on and things are flat and my ears start to hurt after a bit, my room isnt helping,toed in so they cross in front of me works well but somehow outwards,only a bit mind, seems best, thinking of some new floor standers so i may have to start all over again:doh:
Isobariks !
:)