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clarkey555
03-12-2013, 16:02
good afternoon everybody I have purchased a Beresford bushmaster mk2 from Stanley and was wondering if anybody has known a difference when turning all the leds of the front panel or sleep mode as it may be more commonly known.i have a rega appollo and there is a difference when I completely omit the display a more focused sound.any suggestions would be much appreciated cheers :)

StanleyB
03-12-2013, 20:42
LEDS are known to emit noise, which can sometimes affect audio equipment performance. I added the feature to switch off the LEDs so that they won't emit any noise when the music is playing. It can make a difference. It's also one reason why I am not in favour of a LCD display on a DAC. They produce even more noise than a LED.

clarkey555
04-12-2013, 10:31
cheers stan I will certainly give it a go.

Oldpinkman
04-12-2013, 10:37
LEDS are known to emit noise, which can sometimes affect audio equipment performance. I added the feature to switch off the LEDs so that they won't emit any noise when the music is playing. It can make a difference. It's also one reason why I am not in favour of a LCD display on a DAC. They produce even more noise than a LED.
Can you measure that? I know a very nice preamp using leds as bias devices, and a world-class engineer who appears to have missed that point. Of course, it has a nice AOS feel to it, but any science? :scratch:

(And the amp in question, whilst possibly bettered by some since, got fairly stonking reviews and awesome snr performances in its day). And sounds pretty good even now!

http://i1315.photobucket.com/albums/t582/oldpinkman/DSC_0008_zps60037d72.jpg (http://s1315.photobucket.com/user/oldpinkman/media/DSC_0008_zps60037d72.jpg.html)

StanleyB
04-12-2013, 10:53
Can you measure that? I know a very nice preamp using leds as bias devices, and a world-class engineer who appears to have missed that point. Of course, it has a nice AOS feel to it, but any science? :scratch:
LED noise has been known about since those devices appeared on the market. To even asks the question if it can be measured just goes to show how much you know about semiconductor noise. i.e. absolute nothing. Go down to the library and borrow some technical books on semiconductor construction and parameters.

As for world class engineers. May I remind you that AoS has several of us as members. I don't feel in any way inferior to any other DAC engineer out there. They might have bigger budgets and more staff to help them out, but that's it. Nor do I consider the likes or Nick (Lurcher), Paul Haynes, and many others as nothing else than world class engineers. Name me other North American, European or Asian engineers who can do better than us with the cost versus design complexity.

Oldpinkman
04-12-2013, 11:00
LED noise has been known about since those devices appeared on the market. To even asks the question if it can be measured just goes to show how much you know about semiconductor noise. i.e. absolute nothing. Go down to the library and borrow some technical books on semiconductor construction and parameters.

As for world class engineers. May I remind you that AoS has several of us as members. I don't feel in any way inferior to any other DAC engineer out there. They might have bigger budgets and more staff to help them out, but that's it. Nor do I consider the likes or Nick (Lurcher), Paul Haynes, and many others as nothing else than world class engineers. Name me other North American, European or Asian engineers who can do better than us with the cost versus design complexity.

So you can measure the noise in your dac with the leds on and with the leds off? What are the measurements? How much noise is caused by the leds?

StanleyB
04-12-2013, 11:04
So you can measure the noise in your dac with the leds on and with the leds off? What are the measurements? How much noise is caused by the leds?
Why do you ask? Are you looking into buying one?

clarkey555
04-12-2013, 11:10
+1 totally agree stan I myself am not an engineer so therefore wouldn't understand the science behind it all but my ears can certainly tell the difference between no display/led.to me it just sounds so much cleaner and less grainy with no display or lights..forgot to mention I am talking about all my hifi gear not just the bushmaster which sounds superb with or without leds..

Macca
04-12-2013, 11:44
I've a few CD players with defeatable display option - it's been known for years that an LED display can add noise. The difference IME is slight, and sometimes not audible at all but that will depend on the system. It is all grist to the mill. My current fave, the SLP1200 has a display like a Christmas tree and no option to switch it off, though. It would be interesting to see some comparative measurements, , purely out of interest.

Oldpinkman
04-12-2013, 15:52
I've a few CD players with defeatable display option - it's been known for years that an LED display can add noise. The difference IME is slight, and sometimes not audible at all but that will depend on the system. It is all grist to the mill. My current fave, the SLP1200 has a display like a Christmas tree and no option to switch it off, though. It would be interesting to see some comparative measurements, , purely out of interest.

I wouldn't lose sleep over it. I asked Stan the question to better understand whether there was an issue which might be of benefit to me. I knew many manufacturers offer lights dimming facility to reduce the intrusion into lights off listening (as someone discussed with Firebottles phono stage). The avoidance of a straight answer to a straight question about measurement was a clue. My electronics knowledge is feeble. So I rely on others, with whom I have checked this time. LED's are a source of noise in a circuit (1/f) but this can usually be managed (as in the Pip 1 - Pip 2 opted for a solution which removed them from the audio circuit, although with no measurable noise benefit from that modification alone). If present, that noise could also be measured. LED lights in a house will be a potential source of noise to poorly designed equipment due to their use of SMPS. An led light source from a reference DC supply will not be a source of extraneous noise. LED's of course can also go unstable and add a characteristic burble noise to a circuit in which they form part as a functional diode but there is no question of not being sure you have heard it. 1/f noise is also present in transistors and valves, and appropriate circuit design is required. I am accordingly not about to strip out the leds from all the other equipment in the room, the fridge, some of the wallwarts supplying some kit. Just an indicator light will not be "noisy" in any audio application. According to my source, whose ULTRA low noise amp to partner the company's highly rated dac - is plastered in blue leds! http://www.stereophile.com/content/benchmark-debuts-high-dynamic-range-amplifier