View Full Version : The cheapest most fantastic record cleaning brush
Jac Hawk
10-04-2012, 21:22
Is................. a dry Magic Sponge torn in half:eek: yep £1.50 from the corner shop, I have used one for ages for cleaning styli, and one day thought if it grabs all the crap the stylus picks up just by lowering the stylus into it, then why won't it work on the vinyl. Tried it to start with on an old Simon and Garfunkle LP that i'd washed a while ago but stupidly left it a few days on my turntable without any cover so it had a nice layer of dust, the make up of the Magic sponge grabs the particles and holds on to them, unlike all the brushes that i've used over the years that after a while just spread the dirt to a different part of the LP, what more can I say......it works:)
Wakefield Turntables
10-04-2012, 21:30
All the best tweeks are the cheapest!
northwest
10-04-2012, 21:39
What is this Magic Sponge of which you speak Mike?
Piccie?
The Grand Wazoo
10-04-2012, 22:51
Is this Magic Sponge the Magic Eraser Mike?
If so, I would be very careful to check that you're not damaging your playing surfaces, as that stuff is very aggressive.
I've been using and recommending ME for years for styli including on my Koetsu Blacks, but would worry a bit about my vinyl .
Jac Hawk
10-04-2012, 23:49
Is this Magic Sponge the Magic Eraser Mike?
If so, I would be very careful to check that you're not damaging your playing surfaces, as that stuff is very aggressive.
It is the same thing Chris, but the secret is to use it dry not wet, when wet they become a very very fine abrasive, however in a dry state they work really well and i've not had any problems with the LP's I've used it on at all, in fact i've been using one for about 6 months now on a batch of 6 LP's just to see if it does any damage, and to date all i've found is the LP's are cleaner than they've ever been with less crackle and pop than when they've just been washed and with no loss in sound quality what so ever, it seems like the structure of the sponge gets deep into the grooves, grabs the dirt and holds on to it.
Some pics :)
http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb371/jachawk9000/Scalford%202012/IMAG0145.jpghttp://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb371/jachawk9000/Scalford%202012/IMAG0143.jpg
Gmanuk101
12-04-2012, 14:09
is this the JML magic sponge thingy!
is this the JML magic sponge thingy!
Yes.
Only used it on the stylus.
I have a very old parastat for cleaning the vinyl.
Is................. a dry Magic Sponge torn in half:eek: yep £1.50 from the corner shop, I have used one for ages for cleaning styli, and one day thought if it grabs all the crap the stylus picks up just by lowering the stylus into it, then why won't it work on the vinyl. Tried it to start with on an old Simon and Garfunkle LP that i'd washed a while ago but stupidly left it a few days on my turntable without any cover so it had a nice layer of dust, the make up of the Magic sponge grabs the particles and holds on to them, unlike all the brushes that i've used over the years that after a while just spread the dirt to a different part of the LP, what more can I say......it works:)
I have just tried this myself and I have to say the results are staggering, far, far better than my carbon fibre brush... :cheers:
Jac Hawk
12-04-2012, 21:23
I have just tried this myself and I have to say the results are staggering, far, far better than my carbon fibre brush... :cheers:
Did you use the torn edge Dave? if you didn't then give it a go it's even better, the irregular profile gets into all the nooks and crannies :eyebrows:
Aha, and there I was thinking you'd had a eureka moment Mike and didn't know your own strength :lol:
I'll give it a go tomorrow. Cheers for the tip dude :D
Wilkinsons have their own £1.50 for 2:)
Nice tip, Mike. I'll buy one and give it a go. Sometimes even the RCM doesn't get all the dirt out and it would be nice to have a dry cleaning method to supplement the wet.
prestonchipfryer
13-04-2012, 06:28
A useful tip. Intend to visit Wilkinsons later today and give it a try.
John
Gmanuk101
13-04-2012, 08:24
i just bought a pack of ten from fleaBay, £5.45inc delivery!
prestonchipfryer
13-04-2012, 09:39
A useful tip. Intend to visit Wilkinsons later today and give it a try.
John
Well I've been to Wilkinsons and ASDA. Bought Wilko Eraser Sponge and from ASDA Duzzit sponge eraser. Both £1 and four Duzzits and two of the Wilko brand.
Right, have tried the Wilko on Oscar Petersons' Trio We Get Requests, which was very noisy with pips and pops. Now, after a good clean with the sponge and wiped off with a microfibre cloth; the difference is staggering with hardly any pops or clicks at all. :)
I'm going to try it first on some of my 12" singles that were stored in a garage for a couple of years and suffer from lots of surface noise, then run them through the RCM.
How are you guys using it? Cleaning whilst the LP is rotating on the turntable?
Jac Hawk
13-04-2012, 11:11
How are you guys using it? Cleaning whilst the LP is rotating on the turntable?
yes making sue you use the sponge DRY and torn in half using the irregular torn side to clean the record, apply only light pressure to the sponge.
Remember these things are like gremlins they get a little aggressive when wet, never use them wet on your stylus or records as they become abrasive:eyebrows:
prestonchipfryer
13-04-2012, 14:54
Light pressure and dry, don't use wet as too abrasive when wet. Do not rub the vinyl too hard.
John
snuffbox
13-04-2012, 15:50
I was just looking them up on fleabay and my misses walked in and said"I've just bought some of those"
Magick:)
morris_minor
13-04-2012, 16:04
I've been using this for the stylus for a while. Never entered my mind to use it on a record - must give this a go :eek: . . .
I was just looking them up on fleabay and my misses walked in and said"I've just bought some of those"
And you never thought she'd buy you a hi-fi accessory ;)
The Grand Wazoo
13-04-2012, 16:53
Guys, I have got to urge you to use extreme caution before you go too far with this. I'm going to give it a try but I am going to proceed very carefully before trusting it with my first pressing US issue Mothers of Invention albums. Some experimentation is in order here.
As I said earlier, I've been using it to clean stylii for years and have enthusiastically recommended it to a lot of people, but you should know how aggressive M.E. can be. People have removed stylii from the cantilevers of multi thousand ££ cartridges by not being careful with it. This is well documented on the web.
It looks like a sponge, feels like one and it's structure is just like one too - with one difference - the material is microscopically barbed and therefore grippy and potentially abrasive as hell - whether it's wet or dry. That's why it makes such an effective cleaning device, but this can be a double edged sword.
For example, when you clean a stylus, you need to 'dip' it vertically into the foam with the arm's lift/lower device in order to absolutely minimise any sideways movement. cleaning a stylus with a back to front or side to side stroking action can be disastrous.
All I'm suggesting is that someone takes a look at a piece of flat vinyl through a good lens, both before and after giving it a wipe with this stuff to check whether it causes any damage to the surface.
Remember what the barber said: "I can take it off, but I can't put it back on!"
I'll be doing some trials of my own shortly.
Have to say i'd agree and will try it on some car boot finds first.
Jac Hawk
13-04-2012, 21:27
Have to say i'd agree and will try it on some car boot finds first.
While I would agree with chris about taking care and maybe not using it on ££££ LP's , I have used one for about 6 months especially on LP's not even an RCM can get clean and all I can say is that i've not heard any difference in the quality of the recording and quite the opposite it's actually made the secondhand LP's that were destined for the bin due to pops and clicks almost completely free from such noise :). However that's not to say that now I use one every time an LP needs a dust, i'm not stupid and this stuff can't be without a downside, i've just not come across it yet. All i'll say is, use it when your normal record brush can't get the LP clean enough for you, and if you buy secondhand use it when the RCM can't shift all the dirt from your new purchases :)
I'll not be using it on my new stuff just yet, but what I will say is that I tried cleaning up a rat eared and early pressing of Love Over Gold that I was thinking of binning. I bought this album soon after it was released and it has been terribly abused over the years. There were small paint spots on it and it looked very dull with wear. After a good clean up with Magic Sponge the paint spots are gone, the vinyl sheen has returned and it now plays with nary a snap, crackle or pop. I am deeply impressed. I did find that a quick swizzle round with a carbon fibre brush after treating the record with the Magic Sponge removed the lighter crud that remains on the surface.
As abrasive as the sponge is, it can't be anywhere as damaging as a tiny diamond dragging through the grooves at various speeds.
Not that I wouldn't also be cautious for a while, but if this doesn't do long term damage, I think the budget RCM industry is going to take a kicking.
Jac Hawk
14-04-2012, 09:03
As abrasive as the sponge is, it can't be anywhere as damaging as a tiny diamond dragging through the grooves at various speeds.
Not that I wouldn't also be cautious for a while, but if this doesn't do long term damage, I think the budget RCM industry is going to take a kicking.
True
I am sceptical - very very sceptical about this. It cleans dirt off that an RCM cannot? Highly unlikely as it will not be geting to the bottom of the grooves - are we talking proper wet/vacuum RCM or just one of those rotator bath things? There is a world of difference. I honestly don't see how it cannot damage the record. Also a properly set up stylus will not damage the grooves at all.
Martin, find an old charity shop record you hate and that you know is filthy and give it a shot. I was sceptical too but it does work. I can't compare what it does with a decent RCM because I don't own one, but it does its job well enough to stop that knackered copy of Love Over Gold from going in the bin.
Martin, find an old charity shop record you hate and that you know is filthy and give it a shot. I was sceptical too but it does work. I can't compare what it does with a decent RCM because I don't own one, but it does its job well enough to stop that knackered copy of Love Over Gold from going in the bin.
Not disputing that it seems to be effective - my point is how does it work and what are the side effects to that working method. If there are none then fair enough. But as the sponge is used dry by what process is it extracting the grit from the grooves?
I have no idea, your best asking Mike. He's been testing it for a few months with no ill effects seemingly. I can only speak as I find after two days use ;)
The Grand Wazoo
14-04-2012, 10:08
The process can only be that the rough, spiky, fibrous walls of the open cells which make up the foam, catch on to the dust and hold it. I suspect it does get into the bottom of most of the grooves - especially if Mike is using a torn edge.
In that case I would expect groove damage to start becoming noticeable after several cleans because those spiky bits are going to be gripping onto the vinyl as well; but I suppose if only ever used one time on a record it will not cause any noticeable damage.
The Grand Wazoo
14-04-2012, 10:16
Exactly the reason for my caution.
I'm thinking a one-off treatment might get some really badly abused discs back to life, but repeating it could be a mistake. Stick to traditional methods after that.
Jac Hawk
14-04-2012, 11:26
As jay said, what could damage an L.P. any more than a diamond tipped stylus being dragged around?
As jay said, what could damage an L.P. any more than a diamond tipped stylus being dragged around?
Cleaning it with a brillo pad? :lol: It isn't true that the needle damges records providing it is clean, undamaged and properly set up. Yes there is contact so there will be minor wear that will show a little after hundreds of plays.
But: If you are playing dirty records ( and I don't mean Dud and Pete) think about what is happening there on a microscopic level - you have a canyon with a diamond tip running through it, the dust/dirt is mostly big boulders of silicon geting smashed around as the stylus moves through and impacting on the comparitavley soft vinyl walls of the canyon. That is were the damage is occuring.
Clean records played with a clean needle will last you out.
Just ordered one of these before i go any further with my vinyl ripping project, prepared to try pretty much anything on the premise they can be any worse.
Cheers Mike.
anthonyTD
14-04-2012, 15:44
Good find Mike,
i will have to get one and try it out.:)
In the mean time, i thought i would mention a revolutionary new type of Disk i was reading about the other day, apparently it will still play perfectly when scratched, and even after a bit of jam is applied, one was even thrown across a football pitch and still played perfectly...:eyebrows::eek:;):lol:
A...
If you try this sponge on a CD it makes it easy to see how it works. Please note I said if, no complaints please if you didn't want to swap the original mirror appearance for a super-fine grit matt look.
I like the results I get with an ultrasonic bath, tap water, dash of fairy and car screen wash then dried off with a microfibre cloth. Hasn't damaged my Oakley specs so hopefully vinyl is safe too. I won't be testing the sponge on my Oakleys though.
The Grand Wazoo
14-04-2012, 16:45
Ha! My first experiment was going to be on a CD.
The Grand Wazoo
14-04-2012, 17:17
OK so here's what I did.
I took an old CD-R, stuck some masking tape across the centre and stroked the unmasked side of the disc with absolutely minimal downward pressure (almost none). I stroked it three times - top, centre and bottom away from the centre line that was made by the masking tape. Then I repeated those three strokes. The disc was touched 6 times with the sponge and any one point was only touched twice. Remember - hardly any pressure was applied.
I removed the tape & took a photo. It was very difficult to take a decent photo because of the reflective surface. The left hand side is the sponged side. You can see the line where the masking tape was going almost directly away from you. The left hand side is scratched to hell - look at the quadrant between 9 o'clock & 12 o'clock.
http://img268.imageshack.us/img268/5379/dscf4084u.jpg
The Grand Wazoo
14-04-2012, 17:39
I repeated the above, so now this is the result after just 12 strokes over the entire disc - again, no real pressure.
http://img26.imageshack.us/img26/7961/dscf4092f.jpg
The heavy diagonal scratches were already there.
The light's better now!
Does anyone know the relative hardness of polycarbonate versus vinyl?
Jac Hawk
14-04-2012, 19:51
Does anyone know the relative hardness of polycarbonate versus vinyl?
:scratch: erm no :D but i've found out what magic sponges are made of http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Melamine_foam
Reid Malenfant
14-04-2012, 19:54
The open cell foam is microporous and its polymeric substance is very hard, so that when used for cleaning it works like extremely fine sandpaper, getting into tiny grooves and pits in the object being cleaned.
:eek:
The Grand Wazoo
14-04-2012, 20:00
........ i've found out what magic sponges are made of.
Err, yes sorry I knew that, I should have said.
Jac Hawk
14-04-2012, 22:04
to be honest though whenever you clean or polish any surface you're gonna scratch it to some degree, when spray painting you need to use a rubbing compound to get a glass like finish, so just cos something is abrasive doesn't necessarily mean it's a bad thing. My experiments with the magic sponge to date haven't shown any sign of damage to the vinyl, on the contrary it's actually improved the quality of the LP's i've used it on. however longer more regular use may change that, especially now knowing what it's made of. So you may not want to chuck your carbon fibre brush just yet, however as a way of rejuvenating older noisy LP's that are set for the bin or for a spring clean of you're vinyl every now and again these are just the ticket:)
The Grand Wazoo
15-04-2012, 23:03
Mike,
I'm really not trying to rubbish your idea, I'm just using my experience and knowledge of this stuff to try to ensure that no-one does any irreparable damage to their records. If we can prove it does no damage to records, then that's fantastic for everyone - you've provided us with a fantastic way of breathing life into our dodgy old knackered records. But I saw everyone running out to buy it & I couldn't sit & watch them set to frantically rubbing down every record in site knowing what I know.
Anyway, I've been carrying on with my experiments with this idea and today, I tried it on a record.
When I've used the M.E. in the past, I've noticed little specks of it falling away as pressure is applied, so I didn't want bits of it falling into the grooves and staying there after the cleaning process. If it is too abrasive, then those pieces could stay in there and continue gouging out lumps from the groove walls - not so good!
So my solution was to take a record that I bought last week, but haven't cleaned on the RCM yet. I played it once to get a feel for how it sounded then placed it on the RCM, clamped it down and held the sponge against the playing surface for 1 full rotation in each direction. The next step was to clean that side of the record as I would normally, flip it over & repeat on the other side. My thinking was that, hopefully, this process will scrub the record and float & suck out any residue left deep down.
When I played it, my impression was that, yes the record was very much cleaner and with a quieter background than before, but the music was also noticeably quieter and with a much less pronounced sense of dynamic scale than before.
I've just experimented on an LP that was scrap-heap noisy (not mine, I hasten to add, but donated by a friend getting rid of his collection). Two wipes all the way round with the magic sponge and it's very playable with impressively quiet surfaces. I used a torn end, as Mike suggested, with moderate pressure.
While I won't be using it on my precious well stored vinyl, this makes a fantastic restorer of LPs that you otherwise might throw away. Excellent cheap as chips tip, Mike!
This is one of those weird tips that really shouldn't work, but it does. I have many, many old albums that I inherited off my Mum when she passed away last year and bless her, she wasn't great at looking after her records. Now most of them are very playable so for this alone I thank you Mike, it has brought back many pleasant memories... :cool:
freefallrob
17-04-2012, 15:35
Just spotted this thread, interesting, i'll give this ago on some charity shop LPs!
Mike,
I'm really not trying to rubbish your idea, I'm just using my experience and knowledge of this stuff to try to ensure that no-one does any irreparable damage to their records. If we can prove it does no damage to records, then that's fantastic for everyone - you've provided us with a fantastic way of breathing life into our dodgy old knackered records. But I saw everyone running out to buy it & I couldn't sit & watch them set to frantically rubbing down every record in site knowing what I know.
Anyway, I've been carrying on with my experiments with this idea and today, I tried it on a record.
When I've used the M.E. in the past, I've noticed little specks of it falling away as pressure is applied, so I didn't want bits of it falling into the grooves and staying there after the cleaning process. If it is too abrasive, then those pieces could stay in there and continue gouging out lumps from the groove walls - not so good!
So my solution was to take a record that I bought last week, but haven't cleaned on the RCM yet. I played it once to get a feel for how it sounded then placed it on the RCM, clamped it down and held the sponge against the playing surface for 1 full rotation in each direction. The next step was to clean that side of the record as I would normally, flip it over & repeat on the other side. My thinking was that, hopefully, this process will scrub the record and float & suck out any residue left deep down.
When I played it, my impression was that, yes the record was very much cleaner and with a quieter background than before, but the music was also noticeably quieter and with a much less pronounced sense of dynamic scale than before.
You have no controls on that experiment, so any perception of reduced dynamics could be psychological (not saying it is, just that without a control, it can't be ruled out).
I would suggest repeating the experiment on two albums. Play all sides. Then clean one side with the sponge alone, one with sponge and vac, one with the normal wash and vac, and leave the last as it was.
Ideally you should record all sides, pre and post cleaning, in as high a quality format as you can, then play them back to back.
It isn't going to tell you if long-term damage will result, but it certainly will make any immediate damage obvious.
All I've done so far is try it on one album in place of my CF brush. I didn't notice any particular improvement or detriment. I'd be wary of jumping to any conclusions from the description of the sponge as an abrasive. It certainly doesn't scratch glass. It comes down to what material is physically hardest: the sponge or the vinyl. Vinyl records are surprisingly hard (if they weren't they wouldn't last as long as they do, regardless of how well set up the stylus is).
The Grand Wazoo
17-04-2012, 23:30
I think the fact that I took photographs of it's effect on a CD proves 2 things:
1. That I am one of the people who haven't been jumping to conclusions.
2. That there is no doubt whatsoever that the sponge is abrasive.
Your method assumes that all of the sides are equally contaminated - how do we arrange for that?
Actually, as it happens I'm done with this - I'm happy with my record cleaning machine, as I have been for many years.
The effect on the CD & the differing results that Martin, Mike & I obtained show me that there is still some doubt as to whether damage will occur. I already know how to clean records without causing damage. Not only that, but it also prolongs the life of my stylii.
If you or anyone else have absolutely no doubt in your mind that you might be causing damage, then that's fantastic. If you're satisfied that using it doesn't also leave tiny specks of white abrasive material in between the walls of the grooves that may continue to damage both record and stylus long into the future, then that's great too.
Cheers
seoirse2002
18-04-2012, 09:51
Been using one on my stylus for years....never thought of it on a record.
Ive just used it very carefully on just ONE track of an album I really like,but that track was skipping like mad no matter what I did...
Now I have no skipping,just one or two little crackles as it plays over the former skipping part....I can live with that as I couldent play the track before unless I started after the skip which was in the first line of the song.....
So now Ive done the whole LP and noticed it doesent seem to lift everything out of the tracks,so I used a blower brush(the kind for cleaning photo equipment) to blow what was left away....result!!
Thanks....
GT
I think the fact that I took photographs of it's effect on a CD proves 2 things:
1. That I am one of the people who haven't been jumping to conclusions.
2. That there is no doubt whatsoever that the sponge is abrasive.
Your method assumes that all of the sides are equally contaminated - how do we arrange for that?
Actually, as it happens I'm done with this - I'm happy with my record cleaning machine, as I have been for many years.
The effect on the CD & the differing results that Martin, Mike & I obtained show me that there is still some doubt as to whether damage will occur. I already know how to clean records without causing damage. Not only that, but it also prolongs the life of my stylii.
If you or anyone else have absolutely no doubt in your mind that you might be causing damage, then that's fantastic. If you're satisfied that using it doesn't also leave tiny specks of white abrasive material in between the walls of the grooves that may continue to damage both record and stylus long into the future, then that's great too.
Cheers
On the contrary, I'm not at all satisfied with it as an option for record cleaning. But I do think it's interesting, and worth a bit more investigation, though I can see why you aren't interesting in doing anything further.
As for how abrasive it is, that is relative to the material of the CD. How abrasive it is to vinyl is unknown at this point. Having used it in other applications I know that:
A. It's not abrasive to automotive paint, and
B. It's not abrasive to vinyl and leather auto interiors, though it is abrasive to leather surface dyes, but not enough to cause significant wear.
Neither of which proves it's safe for use on a record, and I wouldn't make any such claim. Your mind is made up (and by all appearances was from the start), which is fine.
Perhaps when I have the time and inclination myself I'll use a microscope and see if I can see what's going on in the grooves when one of these things is used.
The Grand Wazoo
18-04-2012, 11:34
Your mind is made up (and by all appearances was from the start), which is fine.
That is absolutely not the case - there's a difference between scepticism and cynicism. I didn't say or do the things I did so that I could say "I told you so", I did them in the hope that we might all benefit from Mike's discovery and be free from worry.
Do you suggest that the next time I'm worried for the safety of other people's valuable belongings, I should just keep quiet, sit back & do nothing?
JazzBones
18-04-2012, 11:49
That is absolutely not the case - there's a difference between scepticism and cynicism. I didn't say or do the things I did so that I could say "I told you so", I did them in the hope that we might all benefit from Mike's discovery and be free from worry.
Do you suggest that the next time I'm worried for the safety of other people's valuable belongings, I should just keep quiet, sit back & do nothing?
Hey Chris, certainly don't you would be doing me and others a big diservice :(
As a matter of interest, whats your thinking on pre-cleaning LPs via steam first and then RCM?
Thanks
Ron
I think your warnings are very valid, Chris, and have made us all take great care with the use of this sponge and with cleaning the record thoroughly after its use to ensure that no 'barbs' are left behind.
Perhaps when I have the time and inclination myself I'll use a microscope and see if I can see what's going on in the grooves when one of these things is used.
That would be extremely helpful Jay... ;)
That is absolutely not the case - there's a difference between scepticism and cynicism. I didn't say or do the things I did so that I could say "I told you so", I did them in the hope that we might all benefit from Mike's discovery and be free from worry.
Do you suggest that the next time I'm worried for the safety of other people's valuable belongings, I should just keep quiet, sit back & do nothing?
I apologize. That was the sense I got from your very first post, but we all know the internet format doesn't convey the subtleties of normal communication.
I reckon the jury is still out though, but your experiments certainly show a need for caution. Others seem to be getting good results, so I'm at a loss to explain what would cause your observation of reduced dynamics. I'm assuming you think the abrasive caused significant groove damage.
At this point, I'd confine the treatment to those records that seem unsalvageable, or which have some very annoying "tics" which haven't been resolved by a couple of good vacuum cleanings.
Interesting thread, chaps...
I've just experimented on an LP that was scrap-heap noisy (not mine, I hasten to add, but donated by a friend getting rid of his collection). Two wipes all the way round with the magic sponge and it's very playable with impressively quiet surfaces. I used a torn end, as Mike suggested, with moderate pressure.
While I won't be using it on my precious well stored vinyl, this makes a fantastic restorer of LPs that you otherwise might throw away. Excellent cheap as chips tip, Mike!
That's my take on it, too, although I only have about 4 records that the above would apply to! :eyebrows:
I'm uber-fussy about the vinyl I buy. Of the 1500 (or so) records I own, 60% were bought brand new (most with the cellophane still on the covers!), and so are utterly minty-mint, and rest (my second-hand buys) I'd say were VG+, so no cheapo sandpaper doo-dah will be going anywhere near them! :nono:
Do it right, make things safe: use a proper RCM! ;)
Marco.
Do it right, make things safe: use a proper RCM! ;)
Yes indeed, but I've found a couple of records where the magic sponge works well as a pre-treatment, followed by a full clean on the RCM.
Sure, matey, whatever works. I just don't have very many manky records, for the simple reason that those I've bought from new, remain as new, and those I've bought second-hand, were carefully selcted as being mint (or at worst VG+), so the RCM takes care of those :)
Anyway, it was a good tip from Mike, if you have a use for these sponges :cool:
Marco.
Gmanuk101
24-05-2012, 16:04
To again back up this post I cleaned a 45 from Michael Jackson that has been sitting in a mates dusty loft for 12 yea without a cover, not one crackle was heard not one!
Does anyone know the relative hardness of polycarbonate versus vinyl?
I have only just stumbled on this thread. One of the problems in comparing the hardness of materials is there are several scales in use, and the values quoted depend on the nature of test method.
Even worse the only figure I could find for melamine is a hardness figure of 4 on the Moh scale (a rather limited scale used by mineralologists) Fortunately the mineral fluorite, which has a hardness of 4 Mohs, has an equivalent figure of 200 Vickers (on the Vickers scale). Thus we have hardness figures (expressed in Vickers) as follows:
Melamine: 200
polycarbonate: 14
polyvinylchloride: ~16
Since a material of low harness will always be scratched by one of higher hardness, it would seem that the melamine foam is quite abrasive and therefore its use should be treated with extreme caution.
Certainly if you have a charity shop acquisition, picked up for next to nothing, and you nothing to loose then by all means gently use the melamine foam.
But for records that are in anyway of value (either monetary or sentimental) the only safe way is to use an RCM. Really dirty records may take a couple of sessions on an RCM, but they will be cleaned. I have had a record, that was unplayable, restored to near mint condition through using an RCM (made by Nitty Gritty)! :)
Mr Kipling
24-05-2012, 20:16
Hi,
Has anyone mentioned vinyl is a compound and its hardness depends on the density of plastic used in any particular mix. Some lps are relatively 'hard' and others are less so. Have a look in your collection.
I've tried cleaning cds all ways and they always end up getting scratched. I had a secondhand disc that was covered in something that just couldn't be removed. In the end I used meths with my finger and shook the residue off. Some smears were left which went witha second application. I now tend to use a soapy finger (!), wash it off under cool runing water, shake excess off pat with tea-towel and left to dry. Occassionly still get the odd scratch. Best I've been able to come up with so far.
Kind Regards,
Stephen
An Uncle of mine once told me that the stylus damages the record, albeit on a microscopic scale, but over time both the stylus and the record will become worn out.
Is this a myth?
Then again, he also worked with fibre optics and told me that if you clean glass fibres with silk, glass is removed by the silk due to the fineness of silk I guess. ??
Hi,
Has anyone mentioned vinyl is a compound and its hardness depends on the density of plastic used in any particular mix. Some lps are relatively 'hard' and others are less so. Have a look in your collection.
I've tried cleaning cds all ways and they always end up getting scratched. I had a secondhand disc that was covered in something that just couldn't be removed. In the end I used meths with my finger and shook the residue off. Some smears were left which went with a second application. I now tend to use a soapy finger (!), wash it off under cool runing water, shake excess off pat with tea-towel and left to dry. Occassionly still get the odd scratch. Best I've been able to come up with so far.
Kind Regards,
Stephen
True the vinyl used for LPs has a range of hardness values, but the range is quite small in comparison to the high value of the melamine.
Like your method to clean CDs - 'the 'soap and water' technique I have used myself.
But for records that are in anyway of value (either monetary or sentimental) the only safe way is to use an RCM. Really dirty records may take a couple of sessions on an RCM, but they will be cleaned. I have had a record, that was unplayable, restored to near mint condition through using an RCM (made by Nitty Gritty)! :)
While I generally agree that an RCM is the best solution (I also have a Nitty Gritty), it's not a panacea. Some records simply need to be scrubbed (and I've found that's one department the NG lacks). I use a Spin Clean as a pre-treatment on the really bad ones - then vac with the NG. it makes a huge difference.
I use a Spin Clean as a pre-treatment on the really bad ones
Which mode is that on the washing machine, then?
Which mode is that on the washing machine, then?
I wish it was so easy.
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