Croft Pre with Sugden Power; anyone tried it?

[Elephantears]

In my all too brief ownership of a Micro 25 and even briefer loan of a 25RS I never quite found the right power amp for my system. I loved the Croft Series 5; the EL84's really wove their magic for me, but it was just a bit lacking in grunt for my Harbeth C7's. I didn't really get on with the Series 7, but I didn't try the 7R.

Just wondering about other options; could Sugden work? It would have to be a Masterclass for the extra power. Has anyone ever heard such a combination?

If realise that is a bit specific, but has anyone successfully used a Croft pre with a solid state but Class A power amp?

[Riislingen]

Hi Andrew,

We are already driving a similar thread offline :)

IMHO the Sugden is great, but especially the newer Class A based designs tend towards a leaner presentation with lots of details. I´m using Harbeths like you and these traits would not be on top of my list.

For Snell, AN or similar it would be great I´m sure.

A solid state device that I know works extremely well with Croft is Exposure. Particularly kit from the Farlowe era. It´s a magical combination, gain stage and sensitivity match very well too :D

[DSJR]

Gawd, a Sugden integrated from the latest series I heard recently into SHL5's sounded clogged and muddy - truly horrible..

The first Sugden I thought of was the now ancient P51. That'd work beautifully into C7's once restored/serviced. Either the input sensitivity could be dropped if necessary, or the Croft gain can be altered if really necessary..

Over to you...

[Elephantears]

Ok this is putting me off pursuing that angle. Regarding Mikkel's feeling that the new ones are leaner, I have heard that the previous generation of Masterclass were warmer and more obviously Class A in sound than the newer generation.

Interesting about the Exposure. I have heard and liked the more recent 23/28, and these are essentially Farlowe designs that Taony Brady has tweaked a bit. I imagine it would be difficult to find someone willing to sell the power amp without the pre.

However my feeling after Scalford this weekend is that I think I am probably going to need valve power to get the sound I want. My favourite system was EL34 based, and I seem to have been gravitating for some time now towards either EL84's or EL34's in some implementation or other.

[DSJR]

So why not look at the Icon Audio cheapy or the Apollon and go on from there?

[Riislingen]

Hi Andrew,

Way to go.

Hate to bring it up again - this one: http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=16336&highlight=audio+innovations

is not at all a bad choice. On the contrary it´s quite perfect for the rest of your setup. If it´s low on mechanical hum and not modified, you should definetely consider it a candidate.

I mean:

25 Class A tube watts with EL34´s
The sound of British wound OPT´s and ERO caps

Quite a combination :eek:

I´m using one of these just now as a loaner, it even matches the gain on my Croft pre quite well. At least it´s worth an audition.

[Elephantears]

Well it is interesting, although I have a couple of other similar options I might try nearby. The problem with this is that I'm not certain 25W will deliver on ALL the music I listen to. This was my experience with the Series 5; a beautiful amp, that suited 80% of the music I listen to, but with my Harbeths it was reaching its limits on either a) large scale orchestral (admittedly, primarily very large scale such as Mahler), or b) dynamic modern pop and rock where percussive attack is crucial.

I've emailed S-Man, the guy who had the room at Scalford which deeply impressed me, because I believe he was using an EL34 based amp into speakers which were of similar sensitivity to my C7's. However, those speakers were CAOW1's and I'm struggling to find much information on the web. Amazing though; I'll start a thread when I've learned more.

I'm in no rush; this is going to be a slow and considered process, and I'll probably be running an experimental Croft system side by side with my Unison Research Pre/DM for a while.