Most natural sounding speaker cable properties

[worthingpagan]

You guys are the experts, i'm getting more and more confused and can't make my mind up. :scratch: What i'd like to know is, in your opinions, what are the properties of the most natural/lifelike sounding speaker cables? Are they solid silver, silver plated or copper? Or are there any other properties of cables available? Does it make a difference what systems/speakers you are using any of these cables with or none at all? Is there a golden rule as such? I've been experimenting with all these cables of varying awg/mm and I just kind of feel like a rabbit getting further and further down a hole :lolsign:

Please help, thanks

[John]

Each will bring in a slightly different flavour
As to the most natural I have no idea Sorry

[WOStantonCS100]

I just kind of feel like a rabbit getting further and further down a hole :lolsign:

I know that feeling. :lol:


Each will bring in a slightly different flavour
As to the most natural I have no idea Sorry

+1

The only thing I pay attention to, at the moment, is the ratio of distance to guage. I'm sure that'll change sooner or later. ;)

[Reid Malenfant]

I tend to stick to stranded OFC copper cables. As John says they'll all tend to sound a bit different even if the overall structure is the same & the same insulation type is used.

You can also purchase carbon cables & a few japanese have used troughs filled with mercury :eek: I think the idea behind the two latter is to completely do away with any metalic crystal boundaries in the cable itself. Carbon is a far worse conductor than any metal though so you often find it also uses OFC copper. Then again Van Den Hul also make a pure carbon speaker cable but it's not something you are going to hide under the carpet, each conductor is nearly an inch thick if i remember right :eek:

If there is any golden rule it might be to not use any silver cable or silver plated come to that with metal dome tweeters (except possibly for beryllium) as it tends to exacurbate any break up modes & makes things rather bright & grating.

These may well be fine with soft domes though :scratch:

As to wire guages it's up to you. As i run an active system & i want good control of the bass drivers i tend to use 6mm^2 wire on those & steadily smaller stuff on higher frequency units.

With a passive speaker due to the action of the crossover you might as well stick with around 2.5mm^2 or smaller depening on the length of the cable...

imo :cool:

[WOStantonCS100]

...a few japanese have used troughs filled with mercury :eek: ...

!!! :eek: !!!

What cable would you run for planar or electrostats?

[Reid Malenfant]

!!! :eek: !!!

What cable would you run for planar or electrostats?
Yeah exactly, the thought of Mercury vapour in the air would scare the shite out of me :mental: Perhaps sir could use some plastic tube & fill that up with Mercury instead :eyebrows:

No idea chap as i have never owned any planars or electrostatics! However as they are driven over virtually the whole diaphram it seems that breakup modes are kind of out the window. I just wouldn't use any high capacitance cables with electrostatics but other than that i can't see any other issues..

I'd probably be more inclined to give silver or silver plated OFC a spin in this instance. Of course it depends on the front end & amplifier as well at the end of the day, we still need synergy after all.

[Stratmangler]

!!! :eek: !!!

What cable would you run for planar or electrostats?

A thick one with high current capability.

[kml]

16 gauge lamp cord. Sounds great, dirt cheap, annoys your audiophile friends and leaves more money for music.

Hey what can I say? I'm Scottish so I'm cheap. :lol::lol::lol:

Page 44
http://www.theaudiocritic.com/back_issues/The_Audio_Critic_16_r.pdf

cheers
ken

[Ali Tait]

A thick one with high current capability.

Yes agreed. I found a thick cable far better than the diy twisted twins I tried on my statics, which is very good with cone drivers. Statics need a low capacitance cable or they sound bright and edgy.

[Effem]

Any cable choice is largely hit and miss because none of them are perfect so you have to pick the particular set of imperfections that suit you. Not very helpful I know, but there are some generalisations that can be made.

From my own observations, solid cored cables have a better bass performance while the treble hasn't quite got the crispness and finesse of a stranded cable and conversely, stranded cables do a tad better in the treble registers.

Silver (as in pure 99.99%) have an overall "cleaner" sound with not too shabby a bass either. I also think that pure silver cables are better at lifting the proverbial "veils" that can mask fine detail, along with less background mush.

Silver plated copper can either be brilliant or dire, but there is no definitive list of what is and what isn't, so it really is a case of pot luck or relying on other people's experience of the various marques. I think silver plating isn't too kind to the treble registers, introduction a lack of refinement and coarseness.

I have heard some good reports recently about Tellurium cables and would like a set to play at some point in time so sort out the hype from reality.

[jantheman]

From my own observations, solid cored cables have a better bass performance while the treble hasn't quite got the crispness and finesse of a stranded cable and conversely, stranded cables do a tad better in the treble registers.


A mix of both is available. I am currently using different gauge solid core mix.
My limited experience tells me these things are a minefield. You dont know what you are going to get until you lay down your wedge and take a chance. Maybe you know a friendly dealer or someone with a few sets you can try, other than that its suck it and see. ( we are still talking cables here, right!).

[WAD62]

I suppose it all depends on your kit, & your wallet...;)

These seem to work very nicely indeed;

http://theartofsound.net/forum/showthread.php?t=10894

[WOStantonCS100]

So, no one's going to man up and run mercury troughs!?! What a sorry bunch. :lol:

I'm thinking of redoing my DIY twists. Maybe this time going for twisted pair twisted together with another twisted pair (pos) and then repeat for the other side. 18 AWG x 4 for each side. And, then do the same for the other channel. Would that be overkill? :scratch:

[Effem]

[B][I]Would that be overkill? :scratch:

Bloodbath more like :lolsign:

[worthingpagan]

thanks chaps for your thoughts on this issue, however, i admit to remaining in the dark still :scratch:

Bought a fair bit of cable lately so will play with it all over the summer months and get back to you with my layman findings, if the Mrs hasn't taken the lot to the scrapyard by then of course :(

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

Very simple, a cable takes a AC wave form of normally up to about 6amps and 100v at peak. So at its simplest look at a similar AC waveform, your mains and the cable it uses. So it is designed for 240v and a 6amp rating would be fine but if you want to pull the cable impedance slightly lower go for 13amp.

Now that is the basics and if you are not a cable believer leave it at that, and if you don't want to wire it yourself then I do a starter cable that is exactly that, a 6amp cable designed for wiring in conduits and terminated called LS2.

BUT it ain't that simple, for a start you could use your cable as a filter to change the characteristics of the music. You do this by messing around with the resistance, capacitance and inductance (LCR). There are proprietary cable on the market that do just this, either by using Litz woven construction or using close proximity plates (like an unwound capacitor) as in the Goertz and Townsend cables. You are proposing a mini version of the litz type in your braided cable. Sorry but for me it is plain bloody daft. If you think you need your speaker cable to change the frequency response of you system then you either have a bad system synergy or you made bad choices of equipment. Another way of tailoring the music is to cut out the frequency extremes by throttling the current transmission a la DNM. Another one is the silly little boxes you see attached to expansive cable like MIT, all they contain is passive filter components like capacitors and / or inductors and / or resistors, again it is a cure, and with all cure they have side effects, it is far better just not to have the illness in the first place.

Now there are ways to improve the transmission without messing with the signal and lots have their own ideas including myself, so I wont bore you with them especially mine. But basically material changes both dielectric and core make changes musically and can be improvements. But basically the best cables are the ones that get out of the way of the music, and what you are proposing is not one of them.

[worthingpagan]

Dr, where am I proposing anything other than trying out some cables to see if I like them?

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

Dr, where am I proposing anything other than trying out some cables to see if I like them?
I quote your earlier post - "thanks chaps for your thoughts on this issue, however, i admit to remaining in the dark still" - that is what I replied to.

[worthingpagan]

I quote your earlier post - "thanks chaps for your thoughts on this issue, however, i admit to remaining in the dark still" - that is what I replied to.



Ok, but I don't understand these comments:

“You are proposing a mini version of the litz type in your braided cable. Sorry but for me it is plain bloody daft. If you think you need your speaker cable to change the frequency response of you system then you either have a bad system synergy or you made bad choices of equipment.”

“and what you are proposing is not one of them.”



I asked a general question, I never "proposed" anything other than trying out different cables so i'm not sure what you're referring to by those other comments above, but I appreciate the time you have taken to reply to my query and wish you good night

[wee tee cee]

I happened across the tellurium blue and managed to get a demo set at home to try.I ended up with the black and cant say I have any desire to change.Didnt sound of anything...just let me enjoy the music,It works really well with the belkin interconnects a lot of us are enjoying.

[Dr Bunsen Honeydew]

Ok, but I don't understand these comments:

“You are proposing a mini version of the litz type in your braided cable. Sorry but for me it is plain bloody daft. If you think you need your speaker cable to change the frequency response of you system then you either have a bad system synergy or you made bad choices of equipment.”

“and what you are proposing is not one of them.”

I asked a general question, I never "proposed" anything other than trying out different cables so i'm not sure what you're referring to by those other comments above, but I appreciate the time you have taken to reply to my query and wish you good night

My goof I attributed a post by someone else to you :-

WOStantonCS100 Wrote

I'm thinking of redoing my DIY twists. Maybe this time going for twisted pair twisted together with another twisted pair (pos) and then repeat for the other side. 18 AWG x 4 for each side. And, then do the same for the other channel. Would that be overkill?

[The Black Adder]

You guys are the experts, i'm getting more and more confused and can't make my mind up. :scratch: What i'd like to know is, in your opinions, what are the properties of the most natural/lifelike sounding speaker cables? Are they solid silver, silver plated or copper? Or are there any other properties of cables available? Does it make a difference what systems/speakers you are using any of these cables with or none at all? Is there a golden rule as such? I've been experimenting with all these cables of varying awg/mm and I just kind of feel like a rabbit getting further and further down a hole :lolsign:

Please help, thanks

Try some Stirling Black Mamba... something like 400 strand ofc copper. Really thick and well made too.. and for £50 you can't go wrong.

Come in a presentation box too.. like you need it.. but still, very good for the layout.

[Effem]

I have a pair of Black Mambas and loathe to get rid of them. I try other cables as a bit of playing around but still go back to the Black Mambas for their lack of colouration and that solid real sound I get from them.

[worthingpagan]

Thanks guys. I've made up my mind from listening to various cables and i've decided to go with solid silver core for all my cabling. I much prefer the higher frequency/brighter sounds, i suppose that's because i mainly listen to electric guitar music. Does cost an arm and a leg though but the clarity on offer is simply breathtaking, even in my budget system. How i wish i'd held onto my better kit and partnered it with silver :doh:

[hifinutt]

the most natural sounding speaker cable i have had so far is analysis plus silver oval , not quite as good as msissing link [silver] cryo ref but not far off