View Full Version : Good sounding value DAC?
DavidJPettifor
21-09-2008, 14:46
From what I've learnt over the past few days, regarding digital music playback, I'm going to need a DAC in-order to get the best from my setup. I'm using an Intel iMac with a Creek CAS 4040 amplifier at present, connected via a standard headphone output port on the iMac with a 3.5mm to RCA phono jack. To improve things (from what I've researched, so I may be wrong), I will need to utilize my iMacs optical output and connect a DAC to it which in turn I'll link up to the Creek amp. Have I got this correct?
I don't have a huge budget for the DAC, probably up to £150 (roughly US$275). I only require a simple DAC, no need for headphone port or anything fancy, just a simple DAC that will let me connect via optical output from my iMac and then connect up my Creek. I must admit I'm not sure whether a USB DAC would suffice? Is a USB connection preferable to an optical one or vice versa? Coaxial is unfortunately, not an option.
So far the DAC's that I've read about in a favorable light are the Entech Number cruncher 203.2 (though I can't find anyone selling this in the UK), Silverstone Ensemble EB01, Firestone fubar II and the Beresford TC-7510. Now some of these do have more than I need, such as the headphone output. Can anyone here point me in the direction of a decent sounding DAC that is within my budget? As I've said, literally a raw DAC with no fancy features will suffice.
Maybe I'll be advised that spending that amount of money won't improve my current setup. If that's the outcome, fine, I'll stick with what I have.
Any advice most appreciated.
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djp
Having only heard the Beresford I'll nonetheless highly recommend it. I have recently started using one, it's partnered with much more expensive gear in my setup and is not shown up at all. Quite the opposite, I've been given a really non-fatiguing, vivid and dynamic sound without the digital 'sheen' I'm used to hearing in even high end players. It's managed to pull me away from exclusively playing vinyl. :P Lots of people have dumped much more expensive equipment for the Beresford. The multiple inputs are ideal if you ever wanted to plug in a CD transport, a Sky Digibox etc. I don't use the headphone out either. For the money it's a no-brainer and will certainly provide a huge upgrade over your Imac's analogue outs when it's plugged in through your iMac's optical out.
The Beresford TC-7510 would be my suggestion. It will do everything you need.
I am about to setup a similar system for use to drive headphones. In this case, it will be PC + Sound card with Optical out -> Beresford DAC -> Headphones.
The choice of headphones is yet to be decided, and I 'spect I will build a valve headphone amp sometime soon, but the DAC will still be used.
DavidJPettifor
21-09-2008, 15:12
I was just about to post a link to this (http://www.silverstonetek.com/products/p_contents.php?pno=eb01&area=usa) DAC as well! Thought it was basic and would suit my needs, but have no idea what it would do for sound quality.
The Beresford does look a very good DAC for the money and it's available just up the road from where I live also! Thanks for the heads-up. Any further recommendations always welcome.
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djp
And if you want to use USB there is this http://www.devilsound.com/ for about £140 delivered as far as I can tell, but I haven't heard one, so don't know how it compairs. But it certainly fits your requirements.
DavidJPettifor
21-09-2008, 15:56
And if you want to use USB there is this http://www.devilsound.com/ for about £140 delivered as far as I can tell, but I haven't heard one, so don't know how it compairs. But it certainly fits your requirements.
Looks the part lurcher, thanks. Don't think I can get it from the UK though, so would have to place an order to the States by the look of things. As an aside, would a USB connection be preferable to an optical one? I personally, have no idea!
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djp
DavidJPettifor
21-09-2008, 16:52
And if you want to use USB there is this http://www.devilsound.com/ for about £140 delivered as far as I can tell, but I haven't heard one, so don't know how it compairs. But it certainly fits your requirements.
Just found out that the Devilsound doesn't support 24/96, whereas the Beresford does. Another plus point for the latter then. :)
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djp
I don't know what would be better USB or not, I know there seems to be issues with Windows driven USB, but I get the impression that things are better with the MAC.
I have been exchanging emails with one of the chaps behind the Devilsound DAC about DAC design, so I have emailed him to check if is as it seems on the web site, $250 incuding shipping (6 Days it seems).
Just to add, I got a response "Yeah, shipping is free to anywhere ... "
If your not into diy then I'd also say the Beresford TC-7510 too if your wanting to spend less than £150
The market for cheap dacs is pretty fierce at the moment, of course there is a large choice of crap out there too ,so be weary of the unknown offerings
The Devilsound job looks interesting, nice and compact, I've not tried one yet
StanleyB
21-09-2008, 20:37
Hi David, I can see that you are worried about the inclusion of a headphone amp and so many extra inputs. As I mentioned to you, you can try my DAC out for a week or two, and if you don't like it or you can find something cheaper that is more to your taste in terms of features, just send the DAC back:).
I developed my DAC for its playback capability, and added a few useful features. But its main aim is to produce beautiful music. By all means try other DACs, then borrow mine to compare your eventual purchase against mine just to see if you made the right choice;).
I'm very pleased with my beresford, I use a 12 volt rechargable battery drill battery ..
it lasts for hours and has improved the sound.. i was shocked how close it was to nicks when we checked them out a couple of weeks ago...
steve
DavidJPettifor
21-09-2008, 21:02
Hi David, I can see that you are worried about the inclusion of a headphone amp and so many extra inputs. As I mentioned to you, you can try my DAC out for a week or two, and if you don't like it or you can find something cheaper that is more to your taste in terms of features, just send the DAC back:).
I developed my DAC for its playback capability, and added a few useful features. But its main aim is to produce beautiful music. By all means try other DACs, then borrow mine to compare your eventual purchase against mine just to see if you made the right choice;).
Hey! Is that Henry? I gather it must be! Not so much worried about the extras to be honest. At first I was putting the feelers out for cheaper options and have since come to the conclusion that there are really only two options open to me that will provide quality sound and a decent price, the devilsound and the Beresford.
My insistence on keeping my Creek amp in the equation, is more sentimentality rather than any audio practicality. I recently discovered that a good friend passed away at the age of 38 a couple of years ago. The amp is a memory from the late eighties. We used to listen away to Pink Floyd, Hawkwind, The Velvet Underground etc. with the aid of that old Creek. :)
The financial aspect is just one of practicallity in these present times. I really am on a tight budget and can't afford to get things wrong first time around to be honest. I realise the price of the Beresford is extremely competitive with regards the DAC market and that is a significant reason for my interest in it. I also like the fact that it supports 24-bit/96 kHz playback which the devilsound does not.
I'll be making a decision by tomorrow, so maybe expect a phone call during the day! ;)
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djp
StanleyB
21-09-2008, 21:12
It's Stanley by the way;), and as I said you can jump on the train and pass by to twist my arm and see how I can make that budget of yours go further:eyebrows:. Plus you can get to hear the DAC in my system and see if you like what you hear. Just bring some test tracks on a CD, including mp3.
AoS members are like family. We are hear to help each other out:).
DavidJPettifor
21-09-2008, 21:25
It's Stanley by the way;)
Stanley! My sincere apologies. That's the wine for you!
I said you can jump on the train and pass by to twist my arm and see how I can make that budget of yours go further:eyebrows:.
Thanks. I may just take you up on the offer. ;)
AoS members are like family. We are hear to help each other out:).
I like this forum. It really does have a great feel about it. :)
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djp
Peter Stockwell
22-09-2008, 12:18
David,
It looks like you're headed that way anyway, but I'd just like to add another "aye" for the Beresford. Mine sits with a CDX/XPS in a Naim system, and in no way plays 2nd fiddle (well, it will if there's a 2nd fiddle on the recording ;) ).
cheers
Peter
Ali Tait
22-09-2008, 12:44
Seconded.You'll really struggle to beat the Beresford at the price.Only way would be to scratch-build your own IMHO.
I like this forum. It really does have a great feel about it.
It's de ganja, man. She float about in de atmosphere, and we all cheeled as an ice cold six-pack of de Red Stripe... :peace:
Marco.
For the price the TC-7510 is well worth going for why not ask the guy if you close if he do sell or return or even a home demo
StanleyB
22-09-2008, 13:54
For the price the TC-7510 is well worth going for why not ask the guy if you close if he do sell or return or even a home demo
You live in Cricklewood??? That's walking distance from me.
I think you would be hard pushed to replicate the Beresford even with DIY, you could possibly hack some boards together from ebay and get a working DAC, but the amount of work involved to get the equivilant in a box with a power supply would work out (I am sure) more than the selling price. Doing real DIY would either involve messing about with SMT adaptors to build something, or getting a PCB made which would eat most of the price of the Berisford before any other parts were ordered.
You don't mention where in the world you are, there may be someone near with one they can let you try?
Another vote for the Beresford.
I've posted many times that it replaced a DAC costing over £2k in my system.
StanleyB
22-09-2008, 15:59
David is passing by tomorrow. I might even get him to listen to the 7510+ prototype, which is the one on view in the 'PC Not Required' picture:eyebrows:.
Nice one!
Keep us updated;)
wow how about a drink sometime
thrunobulaxx
23-09-2008, 06:21
Another thumbs up for Stans DAC here.
Its changed the way i listen to digital sources, it sits on top of an MVX pre-amp that in 1990 cost 25 times as much and apart from my T/T is the only other thing connected to it.
I cant remember the last time i used my CDP, as i`m now using my hard drive when i`m not playing vinyl,the biggest shock for me was the difference it makes to the skybox when watching films, so much so i feel no need to get a surround system.
I got over the lack of USB input with a 15 quid USB to optical convertor from maplin and imo it sounds fantastic.:smoking:
DavidJPettifor
23-09-2008, 07:30
Dropping youngest boy at school, then off to the station and destination Stanley's abode! As long as I don't get lost I should be on my way home with a shiny new Beresford TC-7510 under my arm. :)
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djp
StanleyB
23-09-2008, 08:04
wow how about a drink sometime
You're on:cool:.
DavidJPettifor
23-09-2008, 11:07
The search is over. I now have in my possession, a good sounding, budget DAC! :D Thanks Stanley!
Off home to begin burning her in. :)
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djp
Peter Stockwell
23-09-2008, 12:21
Is it a MK6/3 or the 7510+ ?
StanleyB
23-09-2008, 14:03
The 6/3, but I let David have a listen to the 7510+. I'll leave it to him to give his opinion on it, but I have a feeling that he'll be tied up for a while with his 6/3:).
You're on:cool:.
Check message
DavidJPettifor
24-09-2008, 08:52
The 6/3, but I let David have a listen to the 7510+. I'll leave it to him to give his opinion on it, but I have a feeling that he'll be tied up for a while with his 6/3:).
Exactly that Stanley! I've been held captive by my TC-7510! An awesome investment that definitely has the wow factor as far as I'm concerned. :) I'm listening to my digital music in a whole new light, hearing parts to the music I've obviously been missing out on for ages. The clarity is now fantastic.
All I can add, is thank you to the forum members here who have pointed me in the direction of the Beresford DT-7510. It was the right route for me to take, without question.
As for the 7510+, that looks like it's going to be a wonderful upgrade. Bass was extra immense when previewing it with Stanley, clarity crisp like the 7510 and the built-in headphone amp given some extra oomph! I'm really not knowledgeable enough to let peeps here know about the technical subtleties that Stanley has applied to the new model, so i won't even try!
Definitely one to keep an eye out for when it's released though.
Once again, thanks to everyone here who has helped me in making my DAC purchase. I'm more than happy with the Beresford TC-7510! :D
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djp
Another happy customer, great stuff!:smoking:
colin.hepburn
07-10-2008, 13:37
HI All
Ok So I am thinking of buying one of these Dac kits but which one is best I am aware of the Dac chip TDA1541A you all seem to rave about it will be used for older CD players as well as the latest ones can any one here recommend one of these pre built kits and where too buy :confused:
PS I am aware of the Beresford DT-7510
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